No Small Endeavor with Lee C. Camp

This week, we look at AI purity tests and mass surveillance, then circle back to an ongoing conversation: should social media commentary on people's bodies be off-limits?

We're digging into the Hank Green AI backlash and how AI use has become a sort of cultural purity test that nobody can actually pass. Then we break down Flock’s license-plate cameras and whether safety and privacy can coexist at scale. Last, we revisit our Ariana Grande body conversation to sit with the pushback we got, and clarify our thoughts from an earlier episode.

Th...

As we practice the good life with a bit of rest, we asked four of our team members to choose one of their favorite episodes and explain why. Jakob’s summer staff pick — Kristin Neff: The Power of Self Compassion

Is high self-esteem crucial to human flourishing or rather a hindrance?

“The biggest problem with self-esteem is that it tends to be contingent,” says Kristin Neff. “We only feel good about ourselves when we succeed.” Far too often, high self-esteem breeds narcissism, bullying, and prejudice.

Kristin is a professor of Educational Psychology at the Universi...

This is our unabridged interview with Oliver Burkeman.

As we practice the good life with a bit of rest, we asked four of our team members to choose one of their favorite episodes and explain why. Lee’s co-host on The Subtext Savannah’s summer staff pick — Oliver Burkeman.

In an age full of lifehacks, self-help books, and productivity gurus, many of us only end up busier and more stressed than we were before. What if there’s a better way to live a full, fruitful life?

"The world is bursting...

Lee and Savannah discuss Christopher Nolan's Odyssey – both the social media storms that started before it hit theaters, and lessons inside the film itself.

Christopher Nolan's Odyssey is a blockbuster hit, and has caused a few waves in culture. Elon Musk wants his own "historically accurate" AI version, translator Emily Wilson says the film loses the "wily" Odysseus that exists in the original, and a Christian review site suggests it is blasphemous. Savannah and Lee dig into what these reactions reveal, then talk about the film itself.

Things we mentioned in this episod...

As we practice the good life with a bit of rest, we asked four of our team members to choose one of their favorite episodes and explain why. Lee’s co-host on The Subtext Savannah’s summer staff pick — Oliver Burkeman.

In an age full of lifehacks, self-help books, and productivity gurus, many of us only end up busier and more stressed than we were before. What if there’s a better way to live a full, fruitful life?

"The world is bursting with wonder,” says Oliver Burkeman, “and yet it's the rare productivity guru who seems to...

This is our unabridged interview with the Hillbilly Thomists.

As we practice the good life with a bit of rest we asked four of our team members to choose one of their favorite episodes and explain why. Lee’s summer staff pick—The Hillbilly Thomistis: Bourbon, Bluegrass, and The Bible.

There aren’t many Billboard-charting bluegrass bands made up entirely of Catholic Dominican Friars, who play their shows clad in white tunics and rosaries. In fact, there is precisely one such band: the Hillbilly Thomists.

“A Thomist is someone who follows...

What does our fascination with true crime say about us? This week, Lee and Savannah tackle listener questions. First up, they talk about the upcoming JonBenét Ramsey Netflix series, the line between justice and entertainment, and whether stories about evil can actually shape us for good. 

Speaking of shaping us, how does city planning around data centers form our community and character? What about Israel's conquest narratives in the Old Testament and what they mean for modern conversations about colonialism? Pack your swimtrunks, folks, because we're diving beneath the headlines in this episode!

As we practice the good life with a bit of rest we asked four of our team members to choose one of their favorite episodes and explain why. Lee’s summer staff pick—The Hillbilly Thomistis: Bourbon, Bluegrass, and The Bible.

There aren’t many Billboard-charting bluegrass bands made up entirely of Catholic Dominican Friars, who play their shows clad in white tunics and rosaries. In fact, there is precisely one such band: the Hillbilly Thomists.

“A Thomist is someone who follows the thought and theological teaching of Saint Thomas Aquinas,” they explain. “We combine it with a li...

This is our unabridged interview with Danielle Chapman.

There is a fear that keeps most of us from looking too hard at where we come from: that we will turn over the wrong rock and find something we cannot carry. In the South, a holler is the tangled place on the riverbank you are told not to go. It is also a primal yell, and, as it happens, the sound Marines make. 

Danielle Chapman is a poet, a lecturer at Yale, and the author of the memoir Holler: A Poet Among Patriots. S...

Can I just say something? No, really! What are the boundaries of free speech these days? The conversation continues between Lee, Savannah, and Jacob Mchangama, Founder and Executive Director of The Future of Free Speech. Whether you're a free speech absolutist, a skeptic, or somewhere in between, this episode will challenge your assumptions about the topic. Stay tuned for Lee and Savannah's debrief at the end of the episode! 

And remember, if you want to keep engaging with the conversation in person, you're invited to The Future of Free Speech - Global Free Speech Summit, Oct. 2-3, 2026. 

There is a fear that keeps most of us from looking too hard at where we come from: that we will turn over the wrong rock and find something we cannot carry. In the South, a holler is the tangled place on the riverbank you are told not to go. It is also a primal yell, and, as it happens, the sound Marines make. 

Danielle Chapman is a poet, a lecturer at Yale, and the author of the memoir ⁠Holler: A Poet Among Patriots⁠. She was raised largely by her grandfather, a four-star general and former Commandant of th...

This is our unabridged interview with Annie Jacobsen.

Wouldn't you rather not know how the world ends?

Nine nations hold nuclear weapons, and every one of them is watched, counted, and deterred. A biological weapon needs no nation, no missile, and no submarine. The delivery system is a pair of lungs, and the barrier to entry is a working knowledge of biology and a computer. That asymmetry is why the journalist who wrote the definitive account of how the world ends in seventy-two minutes has spent the last two years on something...

Most people who share misinformation already suspect it is false. 

This is a short preview of Lee's conversation with philosopher Christian B. Miller, from Books You Should Know, our quarterly series on NSE+. His new book, The Honesty Crisis, skips the easy target of lying public figures to ask a harder question: what kind of people do we become when deception gets cheap, convenient, and almost impossible to catch?

The full conversation is available now on NSE+, along with ad-free episodes, bonus content, and exclusive series. 

Giveaway! Every NSE+ member is entered to wi...

Nikki Minaj thanked Elon Musk for saving free speech, so naturally, Lee and Savannah had to phone a friend to learn more about what is going on. Jacob Mchangama, Founder and Executive Director of The Future of Free Speech sat down with The Subtext to discuss everything from social media and censorship to hate speech, political polarization, and the First Amendment. They examine the real costs of protecting speech we disagree with and why history suggests those costs may still be worth paying.

Want to keep learning more? Well, you're in luck because Jacob's organization is hosting...

Wouldn't you rather not know how the world ends?

Nine nations hold nuclear weapons, and every one of them is watched, counted, and deterred. A biological weapon needs no nation, no missile, and no submarine. The delivery system is a pair of lungs, and the barrier to entry is a working knowledge of biology and a computer. That asymmetry is why the journalist who wrote the definitive account of how the world ends in seventy-two minutes has spent the last two years on something that frightens her more.

Annie Jacobsen is a Pulitzer Prize finalist...

This is our unabridged interview with Malcolm Guite.

A frightened knight, cornered in a castle he doesn't understand, grabs a spear he was warned not to touch and drives it into the king. And because the king and the land are one, the whole country goes barren. The rivers empty, the crops fail, nothing can be born. It's called the Dolorous Stroke, and poet Malcolm Guite first heard it at eight years old from his mother. When he protested that the knight didn't know what he was doing, that no world could work this...

What happens when a retired theology professor walks into a party full of deconstructing twenty-somethings? It sounds like the start of a joke. But really. How do we show up for ourselves and the people we love when doubt and deconstruction enter the chat?

This week on The Subtext, Lee and Savannah discuss one of the more defining conversations of modern faith: deconstruction. Whether you're asking big questions yourself or walking alongside someone who is, this episode is an invitation to keep showing up with curiosity, compassion, and hope.

Things we mentioned...

A frightened knight, cornered in a castle he doesn't understand, grabs a spear he was warned not to touch and drives it into the king. And because the king and the land are one, the whole country goes barren. The rivers empty, the crops fail, nothing can be born. It's called the Dolorous Stroke, and poet Malcolm Guite first heard it at eight years old from his mother. When he protested that the knight didn't know what he was doing, that no world could work this way, his mother answered him: “I'm telling you this story because you need to...

This is our unabridged interview with W. Lee Warren.

Can you change your brain? The anxious tendencies, the recurring grief, the patterns of rumination? Our guest today says you can.

Dr. W. Lee Warren is a neurosurgeon and Iraq War veteran who performed 200 brain surgeries in a tent hospital during the war, came home carrying PTSD he wouldn't name for years, and later lost his 19-year-old son to murder. His book, The Life-Changing Art of Self-Brain Surgery, argues that the mind can reshape the very brain it thinks through, and that no...

What do capitalism and hookup culture have in common?

This week, Lee and Savannah unpack the viral Empire State Building skywalker stunt, exploring whether power is inherently corrupting. Lord of the Rings has finally entered the chat! 

They break down a fascinating view on hookup culture, exploring how capitalism, attachment, purity culture, and our understanding of freedom all shape the way we think about sex and relationships.

Things we mentioned in this episode:

Do you really have a shirt from your town? Then Lee will wear it! Mail i...

Can you change your brain? The anxious tendencies, the recurring grief, the patterns of rumination? Our guest today says you can.

Dr. W. Lee Warren is a neurosurgeon and Iraq War veteran who performed 200 brain surgeries in a tent hospital during the war, came home carrying PTSD he wouldn't name for years, and later lost his 19-year-old son to murder. His book, ⁠The Life-Changing Art of Self-Brain Surgery⁠, argues that the mind can reshape the very brain it thinks through, and that no grief, trauma, or lifelong pattern gets the final word on who you become.

This is our unabridged interview with Curtis Chang.

What if our institutions, even the broken ones, are worth saving?

Curtis Chang doesn't think you can understand American politics right now unless you understand one thing, and it isn't what you'd expect. It isn't policy or party. It's fear: an anxiety about future loss that “both” sides are quietly managing, with liberals afraid of having religion imposed on their lives and conservatives afraid of losing a tradition they love. Chang, the founder of ⁠Good Faith⁠ and co-author of The After Party with David French a...

Elon Musk became the world’s first trillionaire! If that doesn’t make you want to talk about money, nothing will.

The world just got its first trillionaire in Elon Musk. While Lee and Savannah aren’t trillionaires, they’ve got their own stories to tell about money. This episode is an open conversation about what we’ve learned about money, what we’d do differently, and how Christians can think about money better.

Things we mentioned in this episode:

Anne-Laure Le Cunff (tiny experiments) on No Small Endeavor

Unconditio...

What if our institutions, even the broken ones, are worth saving?

Curtis Chang doesn't think you can understand American politics right now unless you understand one thing, and it isn't what you'd expect. It isn't policy or party. It's fear: an anxiety about future loss that “both” sides are quietly managing, with liberals afraid of having religion imposed on their lives and conservatives afraid of losing a tradition they love. Chang, the founder of Good Faith and co-author of The After Party with David French and Russell Moore, has spent his life as a bridge person, ever sinc...

This is our unabridged interview with James Kimmel, Jr.

There's a grievance that keeps coming back to you: in the shower, in traffic, at two in the morning. You replay it, win the argument again and settle the score again. It feels like justice, but it never quite satisfies. 

James Kimmel Jr. spent decades trying to understand that pull. At seventeen, he came within seconds of committing a mass shooting, then drove away and devoted his life to the question of why he had wanted it so badly. 

Now on th...

Can creativity transform the darkness of your past?

Lee sits down with Grammy-nominated songwriter Thomm Jutz to discuss his grandfather's suicide, apparently after he was unable to come to terms with the fact that he'd been a Nazi, a friend lost to alcoholism, and Carl Jung's aid in his life, all while sharing songs he's written that helped heal his own inherited darkness.

This episode is a preview of a longer conversation. The full discussion is available in the NSE+ community.

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What does it mean when a “clean” and “family friendly” comedian supports the UFC Freedom 250 fight, rubbing shoulders with unethical and greedy billionaires? 

This isn’t really about Nate Bargatze. It's about all of us and the selective moral lines we draw. This week on The Subtext, Lee and Savannah wrestle with questions of public witness, private relationships, power, and consistency, looking to Jesus' encounters with both the oppressed and the powerful. In a world where every public act seems to communicate something, how do we live with integrity while practicing a morality that refuses to leave anyone behi...

There's a grievance that keeps coming back to you: in the shower, in traffic, at two in the morning. You replay it, win the argument again and settle the score again. It feels like justice, but it never quite satisfies. 

James Kimmel Jr. spent decades trying to understand that pull. At seventeen, he came within seconds of committing a mass shooting, then drove away and devoted his life to the question of why he had wanted it so badly. 

Now on the faculty of Yale's medical school, he makes a startling, evidence-backed claim: revenge is a...

This is our unabridged interview with Lee C. Camp.

In a rare role reversal, No Small Endeavor host Lee C. Camp takes the guest seat as theologian and journalist Russell Moore interviews him about his book, releasing in paperback July 2nd, Scandalous Witness: A Little Political Manifesto for Christians. 

Rather than offering a defense of Christian power in America, Lee reckons honestly with the ways Christians have often been bad neighbors, especially when faith has been reduced to “values” extracted from the story of Jesus and used to control others. Together, Lee and R...

The paperback edition of Lee's book just dropped, and Savannah's got questions!

Savannah and Lee are celebrating the paperback release of Scandalous Witness by working through the book’s big ideas: why Christianity is not a religion but a politic, liberalism, Romans 13, the dream of a Christian America, and, perhaps most important, why Lee can’t stand the word "countercultural.” Use code WITNESS40 for 40% off the paperback, and don't forget to enter the giveaway on Instagram.

Things we mentioned in this episode:

40% OFF SCANDALOUS WITNESS: Use code WITNESS40. Code is good for...

In a rare role reversal, No Small Endeavor host Lee C. Camp takes the guest seat as theologian and journalist Russell Moore interviews him about his book, releasing in paperback July 2nd, Scandalous Witness: A Little Political Manifesto for Christians. 

Rather than offering a defense of Christian power in America, Lee reckons honestly with the ways Christians have often been bad neighbors, especially when faith has been reduced to “values” extracted from the story of Jesus and used to control others. Together, Lee and Russell explore how Christian witness might still serve the common good through humility, prude...

This is our unabridged interview with Allison Russell.

How does someone turn a childhood marked by danger and loss into a life full of music, courage, and joy?

Allison Russell’s life has been marked by trauma, survival, and a persistent return to beauty. After leaving an abusive home as a teenager and finding refuge in the streets and music of Montreal, she slowly discovered that art could become more than escape.  It could become a way to tell the truth and stay alive. In this conversation, Russell reflects on the making of...

We’re doing a temperature check of different cultural artifacts, including the UFC Freedom 250 fight, open theism, the gift of anger, and skinny culture.

This week on The Subtext, Savannah and Lee do a full cultural temperature check. They react to the UFC Freedom 250 chaos (yes, including that post-fight interview), dig into a listener’s question about Open Theism and whether God actually knows how the story ends, explore why anger gets genderized, and wade into the online debate around ultra-thin bodies and who gets to say something. It's theology, body politics, and combat sports…all in one ep...

How does someone turn a childhood marked by danger and loss into a life full of music, courage, and joy?

Allison Russell’s life has been marked by trauma, survival, and a persistent return to beauty. After leaving an abusive home as a teenager and finding refuge in the streets and music of Montreal, she slowly discovered that art could become more than escape.  It could become a way to tell the truth and stay alive. In this conversation, Russell reflects on the making of her breakthrough album Outside Child, the ancestral stories shaping her upcoming memoir, and...

This is our unabridged interview with Marisa Renee Lee.

How do we learn to live with grief when healing takes longer than we hoped?

Author and advocate Marisa Renee Lee learned about grief early, watching her mother move through years of illness before losing her to cancer. Years later, after becoming a mother herself and developing long COVID, Marisa found herself facing a new kind of uncertainty. One that reshaped her body, her work, and her understanding of hope. In this conversation, she reflects on grief, chronic illness, faith, joy, and the...

When the world feels like it's ending, some people buy bunkers, some people move to Argentina, some people stop reading the news entirely. How should Christians behave in the face of existential dread?

Paradise got renewed for a third season, and we're using it as an excuse to ask a question we've all been quietly avoiding: how do you cope when the threat is real? In this episode, Savannah and Lee dig into a Hulu thriller about who gets saved when civilization collapses, Annie Jacobsen's minute-by-minute account of nuclear war, a billionaire building escape routes out of...

How do we learn to live with grief when healing takes longer than we hoped?

Author and advocate Marisa Renee Lee learned about grief early, watching her mother move through years of illness before losing her to cancer. Years later, after becoming a mother herself and developing long COVID, Marisa found herself facing a new kind of uncertainty. One that reshaped her body, her work, and her understanding of hope. In this conversation, she reflects on grief, chronic illness, faith, joy, and the healing that becomes possible when we stop pretending we can carry everything alone.

This is our unabridged interview with Hunter Prosper.

What happens when caring for others costs you the ability to feel?

During the COVID pandemic, Hunter spent his days caring for critically ill patients in the ICU. Over time, the emotional weight became overwhelming. He found himself pulling away not only from patients, but from friends, family, and even his own emotions.

Then one day, desperate to reconnect with the world, he walked outside and struck up a conversation with a stranger. That simple interaction eventually became the viral project Stories...

When a cage fight lands on the White House lawn, it's worth asking… what exactly are we celebrating?

On June 14, 2026 (Flag Day, Trump's 80th birthday, and the eve of America's 250th anniversary) the White House South Lawn will host something it never has before: a UFC cage fight. We're going beneath the spectacle to ask what it actually means when the symbols we use to celebrate a nation reveal something uncomfortable about who that nation has become.

Things we mentioned in this episode:

Nuclear War: A Scenario by Annie Jacobsen

What happens when caring for others costs you the ability to feel?

During the COVID pandemic, Hunter spent his days caring for critically ill patients in the ICU. Over time, the emotional weight became overwhelming. He found himself pulling away not only from patients, but from friends, family, and even his own emotions.

Then one day, desperate to reconnect with the world, he walked outside and struck up a conversation with a stranger. That simple interaction eventually became the viral project Stories From A Stranger, a series built around honest conversations with ordinary people about...