The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming

40 Episodes
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By: Grant Landers

The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming explores what it really takes to swim well — and safely — in open water. Hosted by endurance swimming coach and sport scientist Grant Landers, the podcast brings together swimmer stories, coaching insights, and evidence-based science to unpack performance, preparation, and decision-making in unpredictable environments. Each episode features conversations with open water swimmers, triathletes, coaches, and researchers, covering topics such as training alongside work and family life, adapting to conditions, managing uncertainty, and learning from both success and setbacks. The podcast is informed by Grant’s work coaching endurance swimmers and triathletes, as well as his...

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Will Rollo: Stewardship, Safety and the Rottnest Channel Swim
#40
Last Monday at 10:00 PM

The Rottnest Channel Swim is one of Western Australia's most iconic sporting events, attracting thousands of swimmers, paddlers, skippers, volunteers and supporters each year. But behind every successful crossing is a huge effort to balance tradition, participation and swimmer safety.

In this episode, I speak with Will Rollo, President of the Rottnest Channel Swim Association, about his own journey in open water swimming and what it means to help steward one of the world's largest open water swimming events.

We discuss the origins and evolution of the Rottnest Channel Swim, the role of...


Dr Andrew Lyttle: Biomechanics, Curiosity and the Science of Drag
#39
09/21/2026

Dr Andrew Lyttle has spent more than three decades helping athletes and coaches better understand how humans move through the water. From his PhD research on drag and swimming efficiency at UWA, through nearly 20 years at WAIS, to his current role as National Performance Support Lead for Biomechanics at the AIS, Andrew has been at the forefront of swimming biomechanics in Australia.

In this episode, we explore the science of drag, why efficient swimming should feel easier rather than harder and how our understanding of technique has evolved over time. Andrew shares lessons from his...


Barbara Pellick: I Reckon I Could Swim Back
#38
09/14/2026

Barbara Pellick: I Reckon I Could Swim Back

 

As a child, Barbara Pellick stood on Cottesloe Beach looking out towards Rottnest and wondered whether anyone could swim that far. Years later, after completing her first solo Rottnest crossing, she found herself standing on the beach at Rottnest thinking something even more ambitious:

"I reckon I could swim back."

 

In this episode of The Science & Art of Open Water Swimming, Barb reflects on a lifetime in the water, from discovering open water swimming in Bunbury to completing 30 solo Ro...


Charlotte O'Beirne: Mermaids, Confidence and Finding Your Place in the Water
#37
09/07/2026

Charlotte O'Beirne is the founder of Swimming Women, open water swimmer, coach, community builder and self-described "Chief Mermaid".

In this conversation, Charlotte shares her journey from competitive swimming in England to marathon ocean swimming in Western Australia, including multiple Rottnest Channel crossings and a personal battle with fear in the ocean. More importantly, she explains how those experiences led to the creation of Swimming Women, a community that has helped thousands of women build confidence, develop new skills and discover a sense of belonging in the water.

We discuss the importance of safe...


Dr Jeremy Drake: Persistence, Exercise and Cancer Research
#36
08/31/2026

Dr Jeremy Drake is a cancer researcher at Deakin University, a former elite triathlete and a current world championship age-group medallist. More than twenty years ago, I had the opportunity to coach Jeremy during his early years in elite draft-legal triathlon. Since then, his journey has spanned international triathlon competition, a PhD in cancer biology and a career dedicated to understanding how exercise and stress influence cancer progression.

In this conversation, we explore the lessons Jeremy learnt from elite sport, including a challenging introduction to draft-legal racing in Hobart and the persistence required to bounce...


Prof Peter Reaburn: Successful Ageing, Masters Athletes and Swimming for Life
#35
08/24/2026

What does it mean to age successfully as an athlete?

In this episode, I sit down with Professor Peter Reaburn, one of Australia's leading experts on masters athletes and someone who has spent a lifetime bridging the gap between sport science and real-world athletic performance.

Peter's journey spans competitive swimming, surf lifesaving, triathlon, academia and masters sport. From winning one of Queensland's earliest triathlons and achieving his goal of racing the Ironman World Championship in Hawaii, to leading research into healthy ageing and athletic performance, Peter brings a unique combination of scientific expertise...


William Ellis: Why We Come to the Water
#34
08/17/2026

Why do people come to the water, and what keeps them returning?

In this episode, I’m joined by William Ellis: open-water swimmer, marathon swim coach, actor, voice artist, and host of An Open Water Swimmer's Podcast. Through his own swimming journey and hundreds of conversations with swimmers from around the world, Will has developed a unique perspective on resilience, community, personal growth, and the role the water can play in helping us navigate life's challenges.

Our conversation explores:

Developing mastery when progress feels slow What acting and swimming can teach us ab...


Sam Moore: Community, Inclusion and the GeoBay Swim
#33
08/10/2026

What makes an open water swimming event truly accessible?

In this episode of The Science & Art of Open Water Swimming, I speak with Sam Moore, one of the driving forces behind the GeoBay Swim, a unique 20 km point-to-point swim from Dunsborough to Busselton that has quickly become a favourite on the Western Australian open water swimming calendar.

Sam shares the story of how the event grew from an idea during Ironman WA training sessions in Geographe Bay, and how a chance conversation led him to discover that coach Mick Bray had created a...


Ben Roberts: Participation, Progression and the Growth of Open Water Swimming in WA
#32
08/03/2026

Open water swimming in Western Australia continues to grow, attracting everyone from first-time ocean swimmers to elite athletes competing on the world stage.

In this episode, I speak with Ben Roberts, Manager of Events and Partnerships at Swimming WA, about the evolution of the Swimming WA Open Water Series, now entering its twentieth season. We discuss the factors driving participation growth, how the series caters for swimmers of all ages and abilities, and the role open water swimming can play in building confidence, community and lifelong involvement in the sport.

Ben also shares...


Jordina Quain: Identity, Belonging and the Hidden Impact of Endurance Sport
#31
07/27/2026

What does endurance sport give us beyond fitness and performance?

In this episode, I speak with Jordina Quain, an endurance swimmer, Ironman athlete, sexologist, educator and PhD researcher exploring how exercise shapes women's sexuality and sense of self.

Jordi recently completed her first solo Port to Pub crossing to Rottnest Island after overcoming significant health challenges, using open water swimming as both a comeback goal and a pathway back to confidence, capability and connection.

Our conversation explores the deeper reasons people are drawn to endurance sport, including belonging, identity, purpose and...


Dr Sacha Fulton: Preparation, Adaptability and Performing Under Pressure
#30
07/20/2026

What does great preparation actually look like?

In this episode, I sit down with Dr Sacha Fulton, Accredited Sports Scientist, athlete preparation specialist, founder of Peak Preparation and a two-time Rottnest Channel solo swimmer, to explore how athletes can build the behaviours, routines and adaptability needed to perform when conditions don't go to plan.

Drawing on her experiences in elite sport, her work with Olympic and Paralympic athletes, and her own journey through endurance sport and open water swimming, Sacha shares why preparation is about far more than simply accumulating training kilometres.


Adam O'Byrne: Ice Swimming, Cold Water and Training for the Moments
#29
07/13/2026

In part two of my conversation with Adam O'Byrne, we explore his move from marathon swimming into the world of ice swimming.

Adam discusses cold-water adaptation, preparing for an Ice Mile, the physiological and psychological differences between marathon swimming and ice swimming, and how his background as a paramedic influences his approach to safety and risk.

We also talk about earning the Frosted Triple Crown, becoming an Iron Iceman, balancing endurance sport with family and career, and why some of the most important training sessions are the ones that prepare you for when things don't...


Adam O'Byrne: Ironman, Channel Swimming and the Triple Crown
#28
07/06/2026

Adam O'Byrne's endurance sport journey spans Ironman triathlon, multiple Rottnest Channel crossings and the Triple Crown of Open Water Swimming.

In this first part of our conversation, Adam reflects on his progression from AFL football and paramedic shift work into Ironman racing, qualifying for Kona and eventually discovering marathon swimming. We discuss his first solo Rottnest crossing, the lessons learned from a winter double crossing, the importance of crew and community, and what it took to complete the English Channel, Catalina Channel and Manhattan Island swims.

Along the way, Adam shares insights on preparation, resilience...


Dr Jen Walsh: Sleep, Recovery and Making It Work in Real Life
#27
06/29/2026

In this episode, Grant sits down with Dr Jen Walsh, a sleep scientist at the University of Western Australia, for a practical and grounded conversation about sleep — not as an optimisation strategy, but as a fundamental part of everyday life.

Together, they explore how sleep works, why it matters, and how it fits into the realities of early mornings, work, family demands, and imperfect routines. The discussion covers key concepts such as circadian rhythms, sleep pressure, how much sleep we actually need, and what happens when we don’t get enough.

They also unpack common ques...


Dr Terry Griffiths: Curiosity, Preparation and the Australian Triple Crown
#26
06/22/2026

 

In this episode, Grant speaks with Dr Terry Griffiths, ocean engineer, long-distance swimmer and recent finisher of the Australian Triple Crown of open water swimming.

Terry’s journey into the water hasn’t been about chasing podiums but about curiosity, persistence and a desire to better understand the ocean. From his early experiences around the water through to completing three very different ultra-distance swims across river, coastline and channel environments, this conversation explores what it means to take on big challenges in a thoughtful and deliberate way.

Drawing on his background in ocean engin...


Warwick Dalziel: The Evolving Swim, Race Dynamics and High-Performance Coaching
#25
06/15/2026

In this episode, Grant sits down with high-performance triathlon coach Warwick Dalziel to explore the evolving role of the swim in elite draft-legal racing.

Drawing on over 20 years of coaching experience — from junior development pathways through to Olympic and Commonwealth success — Warwick shares how the swim has shifted from a point of separation to a high-speed, highly skilled entry into the race. With tighter margins than ever before, performance now hinges not just on speed, but on positioning, adaptability, and the ability to execute under pressure from the very first stroke.

The conversation expl...


Duncan Kinnear: Extreme Environments, Cold Water and Racing Beyond Completion
#24
06/08/2026

 

From Rottnest to Celtman—adapting to cold water, managing effort, and learning to race in extreme conditions.

In this episode, I’m joined by Duncan Kinnear, an endurance athlete whose journey spans the Rottnest Channel Swim, Ironman racing, and the unique demands of Celtman in Scotland.

We explore how different environments fundamentally change the experience of open water swimming—from warm, long-duration swims to short, intense exposure in cold water. Duncan shares his insights on managing cold shock, pacing under stress, and the realities of moving from simply completing events to racing them effecti...


The Science & Art of Open Water Swimming: What We’ve Learned So Far
#23
06/01/2026

🟢 New to the podcast? Start here.

This episode brings together what actually matters in open water swimming.

 

Over the past six months, this podcast has explored open water swimming through the voices of swimmers, coaches, scientists and practitioners. In this episode, we step back and reflect.

 

What actually matters when you’re out in the water - when conditions change, plans break down and things don’t go to plan?

 

Drawing on insights from across previous conversations, this episode brings together the key ideas that keep emerg...


Brenton Ford: Technique, Feel and Swimming Effortlessly in Open Water
#22
05/25/2026

What makes good swimming technique actually hold up in open water?

 

In this episode, Grant speaks with swim coach, entrepreneur and Effortless Swimming founder Brenton Ford about the gap between pool swimming and the realities of open water. From stroke mechanics and breathing patterns to racing strategy, mindset and lifelong improvement, Brenton shares insights drawn from nearly two decades of coaching swimmers of all levels — from beginners to professionals.

 

The conversation explores why “perfect” pool technique doesn’t always translate to rough conditions, how swimmers can adapt without overthinking, and what separates...


Mel Tantrum: Open Water Coaching, Athlete Development and High-Performance Leadership
#21
05/18/2026

In this episode, I’m joined by Mel Tantrum, one of Australia’s most experienced swimming coaches, with a career spanning open water, high performance and now para swimming at the national level.

 

Mel reflects on her journey from swimmer to coach, the experiences that shaped her coaching philosophy and the lessons she wishes she had known earlier in her own swimming career. We explore the unique demands of open water racing, including decision-making, race skills, pack positioning and preparing athletes for unpredictable environments.

 

The conversation also dives into athlete development, coachi...


Dave Budge: Water Safety, Risk Management and the Evolution of Mass Participation Events
#20
05/11/2026

In this episode, Grant speaks with Dave Budge, one of Western Australia’s most influential figures in triathlon and mass participation sport, about how water safety, risk management and event delivery have evolved over the past three decades.

As a Life Member of Triathlon WA and Race Director for more than 200 triathlons,  along with major open water swims including the Busselton Jetty Swim and the Rottnest Channel Swim, Dave brings a unique, experience‑based perspective on what it takes to safely deliver events at scale.

The conversation explores how water safety has changed over...


Dina Levačić: From Channel Swims to Researching Adaptation
#19
05/04/2026

In this episode, Grant speaks with Dina Levačić, an elite marathon swimmer, Ocean’s Seven finisher and emerging researcher, about what years of extreme open water swimming can teach us about health, risk and adaptation.

 

Dina reflects on the lived experience of channel swimming:

how pain, fatigue, cold and uncertainty become normalised over time; the role of support crews and community knowledge in managing risk; and why recovery is as much cognitive and emotional as it is physical.

 

Drawing on her transition into research, Dina also shares why she believes the vo...


Kate Bevilaqua: Long‑Course Triathlon Swimming, Pacing and Race‑Day Decisions
#18
04/27/2026

In this episode of The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming, I’m joined by recently retired professional triathlete and coach Kate Bevilaqua to explore the role of swimming in non‑drafting long‑course triathlon.

With the Busselton 100 marking the close of the WA triathlon season, this conversation looks at how athletes should think about the swim not as a standalone effort, but as the first decision of a long race day. Kate reflects on her own career across Ironman, 70.3 and Ultraman, including openly discussing swimming as her relative weakness, and how that shaped her ap...


Vicki Delves: Coaching Beginners, Confidence and Skill Building in Open Water
#17
04/20/2026

In this episode, Grant is joined by Vicki Delves to explore what it really takes to help people feel confident, capable and supported as they begin their journey into open water swimming.

Drawing on her experience coaching beginners and working closely with multisport athletes, Vicki shares how she helps swimmers translate fundamental skills into confidence in real‑world environments. The conversation covers common fears and barriers faced by newcomers, the role of structured progression, and how thoughtful coaching can create safe, welcoming pathways into open water - whether swimmers are there for wellbeing, community, or as...


Does Lighter = Faster? Body Composition and Performance Readiness: A special episode - originally recorded for The Distance Dr: In Practice
#16
04/13/2026

This episode was originally recorded for Dr Kate Baldwin’s podcast, The Distance Dr: In Practice, and is republished here with permission.

In this conversation, Kate and I unpack one of the most persistent ideas in endurance sport — that lighter is always faster. We explore where this belief comes from, how it has been reinforced through measurement culture and why it is often oversimplified or misapplied in practice.

The discussion spans body composition, adipose tissue physiology, muscle mass, bone health, injury risk and the limitations of common measurement tools. We also challenge the notion of “race w...


Mariko Collins: Waves, Curiosity and Adapting in Open Water
#15
04/06/2026

In this episode, Grant speaks with engineer and open‑water swimmer Mariko Collins about how swimmers move in waves, and what those forces feel like in the body. Drawing on her research and her recent first solo Rottnest Channel crossing, Mariko reflects on adaptation, curiosity, and the psychological challenges that emerge when things start to unravel late in a long swim.

 

This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of this land and pay my respects to Elders past and present


Glenn Taylor: Lake Argyle, Risk Management and Creating a World‑Class Open Water Swim
#14
03/30/2026

In this episode, I speak with Glenn Taylor, race director of the Lake Argyle Swim, about what it takes to create and safely deliver one of Australia’s most unique open water events. They explore freshwater swimming, reduced buoyancy, big‑lake conditions, risk management, and why Lake Argyle can behave more like an inland sea than a typical lake.  

For more information on the Lake Argyle Swim visit: www.lakeargyleswim.com

 

And for more events hosted by Glenn in the Kimberly region of Western Australia, check out this site: www.fitevents.com.au 

 

This...


Dr Kate Baldwin: Injury Prevention, Strength Training and When to See a Physio
#13
03/23/2026

In this episode, I’m joined by Dr Kate Baldwin - a physiotherapist, sport scientist, former professional triathlete and Rottnest Channel solo swimmer.

We explore injury in swimmers and endurance athletes, focusing on why injuries occur and how they can be prevented.

Kate shares practical insights on common swimmer injuries, the role of strength training in endurance sport, and how athletes can better manage training load to stay healthy and consistent.

We also discuss when swimmers should seek help from a physiotherapist, and the warning signs that shouldn’t be ignored.

Alon...


Adam Knight: Preparation, Persistence and the Father–Son Channel Crossing
#12
03/16/2026

Qantas pilot Adam Knight shares the journey from years of team swims to committing to a solo Rottnest Channel crossing. Balancing irregular rosters, structured training and lessons from the podcast, Adam prepared meticulously for the challenge. When the official event was cancelled, he and his son Patrick organised an out-of-event tandem crossing - turning months of preparation into one of the most memorable swims of their lives.

 

This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of this land and pay my respects to Elders past and p...


A/Prof Claire Badenhorst: Women’s Physiology, Iron and Performance Wellbeing
#11
03/09/2026

 

In this episode, Associate Professor Claire Badenhorst joins the show to explore the science of women’s health and performance in endurance sport. We discuss menstrual health literacy, iron regulation, hepcidin, and how female athletes can better understand their bodies to support training and wellbeing.   Claire shares insights from her research career across Australia and New Zealand, while also reflecting on her own experiences in triathlon and open water swimming, including the Rottnest Channel Swim.   A timely conversation following International Women’s Day, and an important listen for athletes, coaches, and anyone supporting women in sport.   You can find Cla...


Ryan Evernden: Post-Big Swim Recovery, Strength and the Critical 2-Week Window
#10
03/02/2026

After months of preparation for a long‑distance swim, many athletes reach the finish line without a plan for what comes next.

In this episode, strength and conditioning coach Ryan Evernden breaks down what smart recovery really looks like, from rehydration and real food to gentle movement, early mobility, and the first steps back into training.

A practical and evidence-informed conversation for adult swimmers, coaches and anyone navigating the post-event phase after a major swim.

 

https://www.formidablestrength.com.au/

 

https://www.facebook.com/FormidableStrengthandConditioning

 


Felicity Sheedy-Ryan: Abandonment, Adaptation and the Solo Return
#9
02/23/2026

In 2024, Felicity Sheedy-Ryan lined up for her first solo Rottnest Channel Swim. Fit, prepared, and ready — only for the race to be abandoned mid-crossing in some of the worst conditions in the event’s history.

For many swimmers, that would have been the end of the story.

In this episode, Flick reflects on what it meant to have a deeply personal goal taken away, how injury and identity had already reshaped her relationship with sport, and why she chose to return in 2025 to finish what she started.

We explore the psychology of setbacks, adap...


Dr Angela Spence: SIPE, Hypothermia and Safety in Open Water Swimming
#8
02/18/2026

Marathon swimmer and exercise physiologist Dr Angela Spence joins the podcast to unpack what happens to the heart, lungs and body temperature during long open water swims. We discuss swimming induced pulmonary oedema (SIPE), hypothermia, and emerging considerations around female physiology and individual variability in endurance swimming.

 

Instagram @dr_angie_phd

LinkedIn: angela-spence-69a682a3

 

This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of this land and pay my respects to Elders past and present


Dr Liv Stewart: Vision, Sighting and Confidence in Open Water
#7
02/16/2026

 

Join me as I talk with Dr Olivia “Liv” Stewart an experienced channel swimmer and optometrist, about the relationship between vision, confidence, and performance in open water. We unpack practical sighting techniques, smart goggle choices, and how to navigate changing conditions with more calm and control. A must‑listen for anyone who wants their open water swimming to feel smoother, safer, and more enjoyable.  

Links mentioned:

Lions Outback Vision Kimberley Hub: https://www.outbackvision.com.au/kimberley-hub/ UWA Doctor of Optometry: https://www.uwa.edu.au/study/courses/doctor-of-optometry

 

This interview was recorded on Whadju...


Nathaniel Wells: Preparing the Mind for Long Open Water Swims
#6
02/09/2026

Endurance open water swimming is as much a psychological challenge as it is a physical one, yet mental preparation is often overlooked.

In this episode, psychologist and Rottnest solo swimmer Nathaniel Wells explores how swimmers can work with discomfort, uncertainty, motivation, and self-talk during long swims, while also protecting their mental wellbeing before and after big events.

 

Learn more about Nat’s work: https://northbrisbanepsychologists.com.au/team/nathaniel-wells/

 

This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar, with our guest joining from the lands of the Jagera and Turr...


Gaby Villa: Nutrition, Fuelling and Feeding in the Water
#5
02/02/2026

Sports nutritionist and triathlete Gaby Villa joins the podcast to discuss nutrition for long open water swims, with a focus on fuelling strategies and the practical realities of feeding in the water during events like the Rottnest Channel Swim.

Gaby shares common mistakes swimmers make, how to plan and practise nutrition, and why effective fuelling needs to be individualised.

Learn more about Gaby’s work at:
https://www.intenseatfit.com/


Prof Scott Draper: Ocean Science, Waves and Channel Swims
#4
01/26/2026

In this episode, I’m joined by Professor Scott Draper, an experienced Channel swimmer and ocean scientist, to explore how waves influence swimmers and how route optimisation can improve both performance and safety during Channel swims.

link to the route optimisation website: https://www.rcs.optiswim.com/

 

This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of this land and pay my respects to Elders past and present


April Mobsby: From team to solo: progression, confidence, and reflection.
#3
01/19/2026

In this episode of The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming, I’m joined by April Mobsby to discuss her progression from a team swim to a duo, and now preparation for a solo Rottnest Channel crossing. We explore confidence, reflection, pacing, and what it means to learn to trust your body as the distances increase.

 

This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of this land and pay my respects to Elders past and present


Tyson Landers: Open Water Swimming, Resilience, and the Long Way Around
#2
01/12/2026

In this episode, Tyson Landers shares his journey into open water swimming, the challenges that shaped him along the way, and what he’s learned about resilience, preparation, and embracing the longer path when conditions and life don’t go to plan.

 

This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of this land and pay my respects to Elders past and present

 


Episode 1: Why This Podcast — Stories, Science, and Open Water
#1
01/09/2026

Episode 1 is live.

This podcast isn’t about training plans or race results.

It’s about the people, decisions, and experiences that shape open water swims and what we can learn from them.

In this short episode, I explain why I wanted to start these conversations and what to expect from future episodes.

If there’s someone you think I should talk to on the podcast, let me know.

 

This was recorded on Whadjuk Nyungar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Whadjuk Nyungar people as the Traditional Custodians of this...