The Rest Is Money
Robert Peston and Steph McGovern bring you insightful business and finance stories.Join Robert Peston and Steph McGovern as they delve into the key challenges and opportunities facing today’s business world. From the complexities of tech investments to the impact of political decisions on global markets, this podcast offers valuable perspectives on current financial topics. Whether discussing business funding, economic policies, or corporate strategies, they provide listeners with the tools to understand today’s fast-evolving market.Each episode brings expert analysis on important issues, including market regulations, economic recovery, and the forces shaping the future of work. Robert and Step...
How close is a global markets crash?
With tech stocks falling on fears of data centre delays, is a financial bubble near to bursting? Even as Anthrophic gears up for a record breaking stock market listing? Are CoreWeave's and Oracle's debt wobbles and Alphabet's share price fall the canary in the coal mine? How serious are the challenges faced by Open AI?
Robert talks with Azeem Azhar - founder of leading tech analysis firm Exponential View - about whether AI revenues can continue to rise fast enough to justify the trillions of dollars of annual AI investment. Plus they discuss which...
Why Trump's humiliation could make us richer
Can the US president be reined in on his economically destructive policies? Will we see a resolution on Iran to help bring down oil prices? Why might the markets be ok with US budget deadlock? What does it all mean for the looming Al financial crisis?
Robert and Steph discuss the global economic impact of the US midterm election result. Is he is a wounded tiger who'll retreat, or a caged animal ready to blow? The future of the global economy rests on this answer.
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We got 98 measures but growth ain't one - Paul Johnson's Budget analysis
Why is the government so rubbish at working out who needs help and who doesn't? Will the switcheroo of taxes for entrepreneurs help enterprise? What's wrong with Burnham's housing plan? Why are interest rates so lethal for the government?
With more costed or "scored" measures in this budget than any other, former IFS boss Paul Johnson tells Steph and Robert what hits the mark and what doesn't. Plus Robert is back on his 'linkers' hobby horse.
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...A busy Budget with no growth plan
Tax rises for savers, landlords and bankers, so who wins? Is council tax banding a fair way to dish out help? Where is Healey’s economic vision? Why has he done so little to protect us from a debt crisis? Will government borrowing become unaffordable?
Robert and Steph unpick John Healey’s first budget and discuss whether being boring is good.
The Rest is Money is brought to you by Octopus Energy, Britain’s smart energy pioneer.
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Video Editor: Dylan Bonham
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Executive Producer: Chris Sawyer
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Why don’t billionaire business leaders stand up to Trump?
What is it about Trump’s second term that’s made big money business men capitulate? Are Jeff Besos and Stephen Schwarzman part of a herd of cowards? Will the mid terms bring them some back bone? And who in business is standing up to Trump?
Robert and Steph talk to US journalist Jacob Weisberg about his book ‘Profiles in Cowardice’ looking at leaders who have failed to push back against Trump’s dictatorial behaviour. Plus, they discuss the billionaire bloke obsession with the space race and having their names on buildings.
Should banks pay more tax?
Are banks making excessive profits? How do UK taxes on banks compare to other countries? Should the bank surcharge be increased? What about reducing the interest the banks get from the Bank of England for their cash reserves?
Ahead of the October budget, Robert and Steph discuss the pros and cons of the Chancellor’s potential plan to get more money out of the banks.
The Rest is Money is brought to you by Octopus Energy, Britain’s smart energy pioneer.
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Are creditors too hard on the UK?
Why are economists’ estimates of our fiscal headroom so different from each other? What does the chancellor John Healey need to do to get the markets on side? Will multiple small tax tweaks get us the money we need? Are we realistic enough about public spending? How might tax distribution change with devolution?
Robert and Steph discuss the UK’s economic credibility with Helen Miller - director of the IFS. Plus, more chat on the importance of those pesky ‘linkers’.
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Why French bond turmoil is good for Burnham
Why is France in serious financial trouble? Could it go bust? Should the ECB intervene? And where does that leave the UK government in the bond market ‘ugly contest’?
Robert and Steph discuss how the political paralysis, civil unrest and bond market chaos in France could help Healey and Burnham in the upcoming Budget. Plus, Robert explains ‘linkers’ and why they are Britain’s Achilles Heel.
The Rest is Money is brought to you by Octopus Energy, Britain’s smart energy pioneer. Email: the[email protected] X: @TheRestIsMoney Instagram: @TheRestIsMoney TikTok: @RestIsMoney Advertise with us: [email protected] For more Goalhanger Podcasts, head to www.goalhanger.com Video Editor: Dylan Bonham Exec Producer: Bella Soames General Manager: Tom Whiter
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Should the UK rejoin a struggling European Union?
After Burnham said one option for the UK is to rejoin the EU, would this be best for Britain? How do the alternatives to full membership measure up? And how does the emotional immigration debate fit into the evaluation?
With France in a fiscal mess and the threat from Putin intensifying, Robert and Steph debate whether the UK is or should be on a path to become an EU member again with Anand Menon, Professor of European Politics and Foreign Affairs at King's College London.
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Can Britain lead the world in driverless cars?
Is Wayve the start-up that could at last be a British global AI giant? Why does its boss Alex Kendall think the UK is the best place to grow a tech business? How soon will most of us be riding in driverless taxis and cars?
Robert talks to the founder and chief executive of Wayve, the driverless car developer, about why most of the company’s finance comes from abroad, whether government understands business risk, and why his kind of “world” AI model poses less risks to us than Anthropic’s large language models.
How should the Chancellor fill his hole?
Is a Smorgasbord of tax rises the best way to raise money? Should the capital gains tax rate be aligned with income tax? What about increased taxes on banks?
Dan Neidle is back to tell Robert and Steph what he’d do in the upcoming Budget. Plus, how Reeves was punished by the ONS’s crazy estimates of how much holiday we take
The Rest is Money is brought to you by Octopus Energy, Britain’s smart energy pioneer.
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What’s the cost of Andy Burnham's big plans?
Why was Burnham’s speech such an important economic and political reset? Is his promise of an NHS model for social care all it seems? Burnham has raised the possibility of rejoining the EU, but would European leaders welcome us back?
Robert has been in Liverpool at Labour Conference. He and Steph break down the big moments from Andy Burnham's speech, and ask whether, behind the bold ambitions, the PM has a credible growth plan.
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Why the UK must not drop climate leadership
How to win the net-zero argument with voters again? Why the transition will make us richer? Are the Paris warming targets irredeemably lost? How has China led the way?
Robert discusses with world-leading climate economist Lord [Nicholas] Stern why so many voters have downgraded climate concerns, and what can be done about it.
Nick's book is published by Open Access and is free to read and download from the LSE Press website in a variety of accessible formats, including from third parties including JSTOR, Project MUSE, and in physical format from bookshop retailers.
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Why the world’s economic glue is becoming unstuck
Given the militaristic ambitions of Russia, China and America, how close are we to a catastrophic trade shock? Even without such a shock, do we face years of higher inflation because of the new frictions and costs in global supply chains? And why is the British government the last government to end the tax break exploited by SHEIN and Temu?
Robert discusses the hidden and important vulnerabilities of globalisation’s complex trade networks with Ed Conway, Sky News’s Economics Editor and author of an important new book, Trade World
The...
Why we should all care about Japan’s rising rates
Is Trump’s handling of America’s 40 trillion debt burden about to start a global financial crisis? Why is US Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent selling Euros to buy Japanese Yen? And why are Western leaders worrying about Japanese interest rates going up?
As credit conditions in the US drive up borrowing costs across the world, Robert and Steph talk to hedge fund boss Patrick Boyle about what’s going on and how Burnham and Healey can safeguard public finances and protect us from economic fallout. Plus, did Trump really suggest military intervention as a way to...
Why do the tech bros really want more regulation?
Why has the Al growth-at-all costs plan hit a credibility wall? Is this really about safety? Or are Al bosses trying to keep out more competition? Is pacing realistically enforceable across borders? And could this make tech companies like anti-competitive banks? Plus, where does all this leave presidents Trump versus Xi?
After a dramatic week in the world of Al with apocalyptic warnings and stock market falls, Steph and Robert analyse Dario Amodei's essay on 'why we must pace the frontier' and look at what his proposals would mean for the future of Al...
Ruth Curtice: middle earners need to be taxed more
How much of a buffer does the chancellor have now? What taxes might we need to put up? How does the tax burden on UK workers compare to other countries? Why might middle earners need to pay more?
Ruth Curtice from the Resolution Foundation is back to tell us about what the Rachel Reeves tax rises did to the UK tax wedge and where this leaves John Healey now.
The Rest is Money is brought to you by Octopus Energy, Britain’s smart energy pioneer.
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What's missing from Healey's growth plan?
The chancellor says we're turning a corner, but into what? He wants ministers to take more risks, so what does that mean? Why was their nothing that directly addresses the UK’s vulnerability to a debt crisis? The North is getting a new fund for businesses to scale up - will it make a difference? And what can we learn from microchipping cats?
Robert and Steph dissect the Chancellor's first big speech announcing plans to remove barriers for investment, cutting red tape, tackling risk aversion and getting PuFins to invest more in the private se...
Why is the US debt crisis a big problem for Burnham?
Are we at risk of a global financial crisis? What’s driving it? And why is the UK being punished more than other countries? Is reforming the pensions triple lock part of the answer?
It’s been a wild time on the bond markets, with UK gilts yields at record highs. Robert and Steph explain why global inflation, the state of government borrowing and US tech firms turning to the debt markets for AI build out, is a big deal for the UK. Plus they discuss what it means for the chancellor ahead of the B...
Gordon Brown: ‘I’d tell Trump he’s unpopular’
Former Prime Minister Gordon Brown says fixing broken communities is an economic emergency, but how do we do it?
Burnham’s fiscal devolution? Could social impact bonds work? How do we extract more tax from the super wealthy? What about the shattered world order—can that be mended? What would he say to Trump now if he were PM? And as the man who gave independence to the Bank of England, does he think it’s still fit for purpose?
Gordon Brown talks to Steph and Robert about his new bo...
Why we’re wasting our time predicting the future of AI
Is it possible for us to shape how AI is used rather than have tech firms decide for us? Should the UK government be looking to create our own ChatGPT? Or would open source AI be better for public services? How do we make sure we don’t hand over all our valuable NHS data to a US tech firm?
Dr Laura Gilbert CBE – senior director of AI at the Tony Blair Institute for Global Change talks to Steph about why we should stop asking experts to predict the future of AI because they’re rub...
The 4 challenges (and the biggest opportunity) facing the new PM
Does Burnham’s government have a credible growth plan? Are the fiscal rules still fit for purpose? How can Whitehall be reformed for the AI age - and who will pay tax if AI leads to widespread job losses?
Robert discusses the major challenges facing Burnham and Healey with Lord O’Donnell, former Cabinet Secretary under three British prime ministers.
The Rest is Money is brought to you by Octopus Energy, Britain’s smart energy pioneer.
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The world’s most influential economist: how we can deliver "worker-friendly AI"
How damaging to us is the obsession of Anthropic, Google and Open AI with creating AI super intelligence? How can political leaders set a new path for AI, that would enrich workers rather than replace them? And is the falling birth rate actually good for us?
In the second part of Robert’s interview with Nobel prize-winning economist Daron Acemoglu, about his influential new book, “what happened to liberal democracy”, we learn whether AI can be tamed to prevent most of the rewards going to trillionaires.
The Re...
The world’s most influential economist: Tax wealth and break up big tech
How do we revive living standards and restore confidence in liberal democracy? Is the link between productivity and wages permanently broken? What is working-class liberalism? Why should Andy Burnham’s first budget raise taxes on capital while cutting taxes on employment? And why are tech giants like Google and Amazon twice as wealthy as the British Empire at its peak?
Robert investigates how to safeguard our way of life with Nobel Prize–winning economist Daron Acemoglu. Together, they discuss whether the prescriptions in Acemoglu's influential new book are practical enough to prevent liberal democracy from...
The Apprentice Unicorn - Euan Blair on rewiring investment and training
Why is it taking so long to get people trained in AI? Should we be devolving education powers to employers instead of Mayors? Is the replacement for the Apprenticeship levy any good? Why is it so hard for companies here to raise money from British investors?
Steph talks to Euan Blair, CEO of Multiverse - the UK’s first British EdTech business valued at over a billion - about the future of work. Plus some spicy chat on Multiverse’s Ofsted rating and why Euan’s dad was wrong to push for 50% of young people...
Why Burnham’s best economic policy would be “do nothing”
How can the government persuade UK companies and households to invest and spend their record cash holdings? Why is Donald Trump’s unpredictability failing to destroy economic growth? Why is it so difficult to assess whether a lethal AI bubble currently exists?
Robert discusses the risks and opportunities in today’s world of extreme financial, technological and political risks with Karen Ward, chief market strategist for JP Morgan in EMEA.
The Rest is Money is brought to you by Octopus Energy, Britain’s smart energy pioneer.
Why making schools truly comprehensive is vital for our economy
Why do secondary schools fail so many young people? Whose fault is it? What does good vocational education look like? He says the hard hat is just as important as the graduation cap, but does Andy Burnham really get it?
With A-Level and GCSE results due out, Steph’s launched a day to celebrate the millions of people getting vocational qualifications. To mark this we take the show to a thriving business in Cornwall to look at how they’re solving their skills problem. Also, Robert and Steph unpick the crisis in British education and...
Can the West bridge the gap with China, India and the BRICs+ nations?
How fixable is the schism between the rich developed countries, led by the US, and the faster-growing BRICS+ group, led by China, Russia, and India? Can these emerging powerhouses truly detach themselves from the dollar-dominated financial system? And on which critical issues must we work collaboratively with them to avoid global disaster?
Robert and Steph chat with Lord Jim O’Neill, the former Goldman Sachs chief economist who coined the influential BRIC concept 25 years ago. He has recently launched a new strategy platform and think tank, BRICS+ Thinking, designed to encourage pragmatic entente and policy cooperation with thes...
Why Chinese AI needs to be taken more seriously
Are we in an AI bubble? Does it matter that Chinese AI firms are banned from using American chips? How big is the chance of an AI crash? Can an AI business survive without energy generation capabilities?
Azeem Azhar – the founder of the leading research platform Exponential View – joins us to tell us about his report on the state of the AI economy. Plus, Robert and Steph find out what Azeem learnt about AI from a visit to a Chinese night club with the Moonshot gang.
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Does Burnham get AI?
What parts of AI does the UK have to control to secure ourselves against enemies? Does Burnham understand how important AI is for growth and security? Are entrepreneurs less welcome in the UK now? Why should the government support a ‘freedom to fail’ funding and business culture?
Matt Clifford wrote Starmer’s AI action plan. He is a tech investor and co-founder of the billion dollar business Entrepreneurs First. He talks to Robert and Steph about UK AI policy and chairing the organisation ARIA that hands out government funding for fundamental tech research. Plus find out...
299. Trump’s new tariffs - can anyone win a trade war?
How has Donald Trump got away with bringing in new tariffs when the last lot were ruled unlawful? Why is the UK in a worse position than the EU now? Are trade wars always bad? Had anyone ever won one without harming themselves? Are we ever going to get back to free trade?
Robert and Steph are joined by economist and FT columnist Soumaya Keynes, self-confessed trade nerd and author of ‘How to win a trade war’ to evaluate the damage from Trump’s new wave of tariffs on 60 countries.
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Why Healey as Chancellor? And can he find the money?
John Healey is the Chancellor to increase defence spending to 3% of GDP, but how will he pay for it? Would war bonds do the trick? Is a cut in electricity VAT and a rise in income tax thresholds helping the right people? What will it take to build enough council houses? With the surprise appointment of former defence secretary John Healey as Burnham's new Chancellor, we look at whether he can revive the UK. Plus Robert and Steph wonder whether the hidden hand of Gordon Brown is behind Healey's appointment. The Rest is Money is brought to you by...
How do we reshape our workforce in the AI era?
What should the government be doing to get us AI ready? How do we make sure people co-exist with AI and aren't just replaced by it? What role should trade unions have? What are 'tech towns' and how important are they in the AI race?
Nobel prize winning economist Simon Johnson is back to tell us about his role as the chair of the government’s AI Institute which will use workplace data shared by over thirty major corporations to track, in real-time, how AI adoption is shifting job availability, wage growth, and macroeconomic pr...
Gary Stevenson- how would a wealth tax help those on low incomes?
What impact would a 2% wealth tax on people with £10 million have? If you tax the rich more will it bring down the cost of living for everyone else? How will this help the shortfall of affordable homes? What about the North South divide? Will it reduce the one million NEETs the country has? Will it grow the economy?
Inequality economist Gary Stevenson is back to tell us why taxing millionaires is the way to make things fairer. Robert and Steph have a lively debate about whether wealth taxes are enough.
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Jim O’Neill – The man shaping Burnhamomics
If fiscal devolution is central to Burnham’s plans, how do we make sure the money is not wasted by mayors and councils? How can Burnham avoid market mayhem if he invests significantly more? Would it be crazy to break up the Treasury? Why is scrapping the pensions triple lock essential?
Former U.K. Treasury Minister and ex Goldman Sachs chair Jim O’Neill has been advising Andy Burnham on the hard choices he’ll have to make as PM. Steph and Robert talk to him about Manchesterism and the need to sla...
Gary Stevenson – Is being a city trader bad?
Is it fair that city traders can make loads of money betting on the economy’s demise? Are people with working class backgrounds better at trading? How do you go from making millions on a trade floor to becoming obsessed with wealth inequality?
In the first of our two-part series, we sit down with economist Gary Stevenson. He tells us how he made millions by betting on our economic decline, and why he transitioned from a high-stakes trader to a man on a mission to tax millionaires more-a journey explored in his new Channel 4 documentary, How to...
A Nobel Prize winning view on wealth inequality
Why are some countries richer than others, even though money, people and ideas can flow freely round the world? Why is it so hard for a country to turn things around and become rich? Are illiberal leaders like Trump good for their economy? What role do sovereign wealth funds play?
Nobel prize winning economist Simon Johnson gives us his theory on the damage extractive institutions do to wealth disparity. As a leading professor at MIT and former chief economist at the IMF, Robert and Steph quiz him on how the history of colonisation has...
The £6 trillion pot we should use to grow the economy
How do we unlock trillions of pounds of long term capital and keep it in the UK? What can we learn from a brewery in Newcastle and the Vimto factory in Manchester? Why don’t more people invest in start-ups and scale-ups? Is it all about tax incentives?
Nigel Wilson is the former CEO of the financial giant Legal and General who has funnelled billions of pounds of pension and insurance money into regional regeneration projects. He tells us why it’s not a charity case, but a huge investment opportunity that could grow the whole UK econom...
Does Burnham have any wiggle room?
How much can Burnham re-engineer the fiscal rules? Should he stick to a manifesto that has already been trampled over? Who should he choose to be chancellor? Will the markets approve?
The former director of the IFS is back to tell us about the constraints and opportunities the new prime minister will have to get the economy growing and improve living standards. Listen to Robert and Steph’s interview with Paul Johnson.
The Rest is Money is brought to you by Octopus Energy, Britain’s smart energy pioneer.
Can Burnham’s ‘business friendly socialism’ grow the economy?
Why are each of us £15,000 a year worse off than we should be? What can we learn from the US about housing? Can ‘Manchesterism’ work across the UK? How much is the triple lock state pension holding back young people?
Paul Johnson, former director of the IFS, is back to tell us about his new research on The Prosperity Gap and what it means for the new Prime Minister. Plus why Count Binface should be considered for housing minister.
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