Blue Grit Radio: the Police Performance Podcast: Mindset, Wellness, Leadership
Welcome to Blue Grit Radio: the podcast for police officers, first responders, and service-minded leaders who want to elevate their performance in career and life. Hosted by Eric Tung, an active police leader, trainer, and mentor, this show explores topics, lessons, and resources, for listeners with to achieve professional excellence and personal resilience.Each episode features raw conversations, actionable insights, and interviews with leaders in law enforcement, wellness experts, veterans, and high performers who share their lessons on overcoming adversity, leading with purpose, and creating positive change in their first responder and organizational culture.Whether you’re a rookie, veteran off...
352:Police Careers, Leadership, Tech Innovation w/ Christian Quinn
In this episode, I am joined by former police leader and tech innovator Christian Quinn for a wide-ranging conversation about a career that took an unconventional path through policing, leadership, and modern public safety. Christian shares how unexpected assignments, high-pressure roles, and a willingness to learn helped shape the way he led teams, built new programs, and navigated change inside a large agency.
The discussion covers themes around identity, adaptability, and what it really means to stay useful as your career evolves.The conversation also opens the door to a deeper look at the balance between mission a...
351: Police Career Rise, Ego, Pressure & Growth w/ Dr. Ron Camacho
In this conversation, I visit with retired chief Dr. Ron Camacho to talk about the real work behind leadership: self-awareness, humility, trust, and the courage to confront ego. Ron shares the career journey that took him from rapid promotion in policing to leading a large department, and the personal transformation that reshaped how he leads today.
Ron explains that being “successful” in rank didn’t mean he was leading well. In fact, the pressure of rapid advancement, unresolved trauma, and a need to prove himself pushed him into a style that got results but alienated many of the pe...
350: Front-Line Police Leadership (Learning, Teaching, Training) w/ Chief Jeremy Story
In the world of policing, leadership is not just about authority; it’s about learning, growing, and mentoring others through the challenges faced along the way. In this episode, I am joined by Chief Jeremy Story, who emphasizes the importance of experiential learning and robust training in law enforcement. His journey is a testament to how mistakes can lead to profound growth and the cultivation of effective leadership qualities.
Beyond a significant background in tactics, Chief Story is a front-line, demonstrative leader, competing in the fitness tests and obstacle courses he asks of his own people. (This is...
349: Why are Police Teams Failing? 3 Things to Improve for Individuals and Agencies
We are at a loss. We have this Mission, but we are floundering. People don't feel they are making a difference. That their work doesn't matter.
Are we here to just do a job, or are we here to serve a Purpose? Am I a replaceable cog? Do I make impact? Does anyone care if I stay or go?
In this quick episode, I share three things that are lacking from many individuals and teams (and many segments of society). By recognizing them and building upon them in our direct circles of influence, we should have...
348: Should People Become Cops? Mentoring Next Gen Protectors w/ Sgt. Pat Morgan
In this episode, I am joined by esteemed, long-time colleague Sgt. Pat Morgan. We delve into the intricacies of policing today, addressing the evolving culture and leadership challenges within law enforcement.
Significant themes of the conversation include the importance of peer support, intentional mentorship, and positive outlook within police culture. We also talk on the generational differences shaping today's policing landscape.
As a proud father of a new officer, Pat reflects on the conversations he's had with his son about pursuing a career in law enforcement. We discuss the challenges of officers not being advocates for...
347: Identity & Challenges in Police & Law Enforcement w/ Dr. Jaimie Lusk
From its roots, compassion means "to suffer with." Careers and lifestyles in the first and frontline responder professions are inundated with exposure to stress and hurt - from the people we help in the public, to the people we work alongside daily. If left unchecked, the impacts can overwhelm us, and my guest in this episode helps not only explain the multi-layered "why," but many systems and strategies we can explore to help navigate the challenges and promote our positive resolve.
In this episode, Dr. Jamie Lusk shares insights on resilience, identity transition, moral injury, and the im...
346: Private Sector to Police Leader, Financial Health w/ Chief Tim Meyer
In this episode, Chief Tim Meyer shares his unique journey from private industry to the police profession, emphasizing innovative approaches to public safety, wellness, and financial planning. Discover how a mindset shift and creative strategies can transform policing and personal growth.
Key Topics:
Career transition from private industry to law enforcementInnovative approaches to public safety, such as using coloring books for Alzheimer's patientsThe importance of wellness and peer support in policingFinancial planning and investment metaphors for life and careerCommunity engagement and adaptive policing models—
Tim Meyer is a captain with the King County Sh...
345: GOOD GRIT: The Check In - Purpose, Team, and Self
We may be good at checking in on our people, our buddies, those around us. But how often do we hit pause and check in on what we are doing? The work we do, the way in which we do it? Our personal Mission?
In this quick episode, I explore this discussion, starting with quick reflection on the show itself, then adding in a layer of self-check. It goes beyond a temperature gauge, and into forecasting to see if we are living in accordance with our ultimate path and goals.
I want to know how YOU...
344: Police Profession, Greater Purpose, Stoicism and Wellness on The Chief Exchange
Hi, I'm Eric. I didn't always want to be a police officer, in fact, if you asked 10 or 18 year old Eric, he would have been likely puzzled, thinking you were joking. I find that new people are finding my podcast, writing, and newsletter continually. An introduction can thus, be helpful. This episode features an interview that I absolutely loved taking part in, as it goes far beyond my background, and deep into perspectives on policing and leadership needed today.
After interviews, I feel a mixture of sentiments. I appreciate the depth of conversation that generally occurs, I feel...
343: GOOD GRIT - How a Kid is Helping Others Dream Again, and How You Can Help!
This job (and life) affords countless examples of inspirational things that humans are capable of. It's that much more impactful and awe striking when it's one of our youth- shining a beacon of what's possible.
I saw this young man, Atharv, at a local council presentation as he shared about how his personal medical challenges as a kid, and seeing other kids struggling with devastating diagnoses inspired him to start his own non-profit. He came up with the idea of taking kids' drawings of characters and creating 3D printed renderings, so they could hold their actual creations in...
342: Moral Injury, Police & First Responders, Pathways & Prevention, Dr. Brooke Bartlett returns
In this episode, Dr. Brooke Bartlett returns and discusses the concept of moral injury, its pathways, contributing factors, and strategies for recognition and support within public safety and military communities.
Key Insights:
You can contact Dr. Brooke on prior Blue Grit Radio episodes 63 and 115.
and https://www.linkedin.com/in/drbartlettphd/
#moral i...
341: Good GRIT - On & Off Duty Passions, Car Crash Rehab & Police, Limitless Momentum, w/ Ariana Stone
In this episode, Ariana Stone shares her inspiring journey of resilience, mental health advocacy, and leadership in first responder communities. We explore her personal experiences: grappling with extreme physical injury and rehab, innovative police programs like co-response units, building a brand that is helping first responder mental health, and practical advice for mental wellness and professional growth.
Ariana is an active police officer and the founder of Limitless Momentum. She is a returning guest from the highly popular FTO panel episode, #192.
Find out more at: https://limitlessmomentum.us/
#resilience #mentalhealth #firstresponders #coresponseunits #leadership...
340: Police & Martial Arts, Training, Identity & More! w/ Jason Harney
Story-telling is a key element core to our human existence, and is one that is unmatched in teaching, depicting, and building understanding. My guest, Jason Harney, retired Las Vegas Metro sergeant and veteran turned documentary creator joins me to discuss themes emergent from his career, necessity for legitimate training, and complex issues in policing lives and careers.
We explore the dynamics of the policing industry, shifting culture, mental health, the importance of continuous learning, and how to transition into life after policing. Jason shares with deep perspective from his time on the street, FTO, DT instructor, investigations, re...
339: Highs and Lows, Working K-9 Units & Rocky Mentality w/Chris Bingham
There's a saying in K-9 work: the only thing two handlers can agree on... is that the third is messed up.
Luckily this isn't real true, as my guest Chris Bingham and I have much we agree on. There's another more significant saying in K-9 work - which is that the assignment will bring you the highest highs and lowest lows.
Chris shares about his career in federal police work, and how his career evolved with key leadership, mentorship, and sponsorship. We talk about the unique challenges and bonds with our K-9 partners and connect over...
338: Identity and Stoicism for Resilience, w/ Alec Wons
Alec Wons is something(s) else. You may recognize he's the name, voice, and mind behind The Chief Exchange podcast. Getting to flip the mics and get him on the interviewed side of the table, I've truly enjoyed learning more about his own story and how he arrived here, truly innovating the perspective by which we can integrate leadership and wellness- of individuals and organizations.
He's an innovator, an expander, a self-developer. It didn't take me long in conversations pre-recording to recognize how much of an abundance mindset he carries, mixed with an appreciation with integrating old kno...
337: TRUST - How Bosses Trash it and How we Rebuild it, w/ Christine Townsend (pt. 2)
In this episode, Christine Townsend returns and we highlight key lessons for building, repairing, and fostering trust for leaders.
In the last episode, we discussed her story, various roles in policing and experiences as an impetus to research and dive into all things about the concept. Here, we discuss the critical role of trust in organizations, especially in law enforcement, exploring how societal shifts, organizational culture, and leadership impact trust levels.
The conversation offers practical insights on building institutional courage, fostering authenticity, and enhancing self-trust to improve morale, performance, and community relations.
Key To...
336: Broken Trust is Killing Your Organization, and What to Do About it, Christine Townsend pt. 1
In this insightful interview, Christine Townsend shares her unique journey from journalism to policing and her deep exploration of trust, moral courage, and mental health in first responder communities. We use her book (Trust) as a jump-off point for key themes that affect every relationship, perception, and organization.
She shares how trust underpins organizational culture, personal resilience, and effective leadership, with practical insights on fostering trust and well-being.
We discuss:
Trust as the foundation of organizational and interpersonal relationsThe role of moral courage in leadership and ethicsMental health challenges and innovative therapies like ketamine-assisted p...335: Ice Bath, Sauna, Red Light, Vagus Nerve Recovery Every Agency Needs, w/ Rich Ganley
Our bodies and minds get beat up by the job. The gear wearing down our posture, backs and hips. Our mainstays of caffeine and cortisol, the long shifts and hypervigilance rollercoaster that can feel like a crash out, or even scarier... like total numbness. There's something real, tangible, and scientific we can do about it all.
In this episode, Rich Ganley shares his inspiring journey, focusing on proactive health strategies for first responders. Discover the ins and outs of innovative tools like red light therapy, grounding, sauna, and cold water immersion that enhance recovery, resilience, and overall wel...
334: The Undead or the Un-Living? Crash & Lost Purpose in First Responder Work, w/ Jon Vargas
How many people are just going through the motions.. surviving...autopilot? Simply existing, sub-optimally, and not LIVING? In our high-stress, high-paced first responder careers, it's all too common. I'm excited to feature Jon Vargas, deep thinker, firefighter, podcast host of the Grab Lives Podcast.
Jon and I connected on his show, re-aired here in ep. 288, where we discussed the decline of first responder jobs and hypervigilance dynamics. In this follow up conversation, we talk on:
Illusion of control and reactive responseNihilistic collapse and loss of purposeThe role of trust and vulnerabilityPractical strategies for resilience and self-awarenessJo...
333: Warriors in First Responder Work, Understanding and Supporting the Warrior Archetype
As first responders, you face intense pressure and trauma daily. But what does it really take to build mental resilience in such demanding roles? In this episode, we’ll explore key insights shared by Matt Domyancic analyzing the Warrior archetype which we often (over)identify with in first responder work. We discuss fostering meaningful psychological strength and wellness beyond the "go harder" mentality which works...until it doesn't.
Listen along to explore how understanding how pause, humility, and integrating diverse psychological tools can foster greater resilience and wellbeing within the high-stakes worlds of police, fire, and military. This...
332: Empty Leadership, How to Spot It, and What to Do to Fix It
In this insightful interview, retired police chief Kristen Ziman shares her leadership journey, the importance of humility, embracing continuous learning, and fostering a culture of curiosity and respect within law enforcement. Discover practical strategies for authentic leadership, overcoming imposter syndrome, and building resilient teams.
Leadership humility and continuous learningBuilding a culture of curiosity and respectful dissentOvercoming imposter syndrome and self-doubtThe role of vulnerability and authenticity in leadershipStrategies for fostering agency culture and influenceKristen Ziman is a dynamic leader and keynote speaker known for her transformative impact across various industries. With over 20 years of leadership experience, Kristen...
331: Dispatch Saved My Life from Suicide w/ fmr. Officer Tricia Small (First Responder Wellness & Resilience)
“Saved by the bell.” The phrase that accompanied a situation with mounting tension… built up the the brink. A moment of dread impending, and then a sound or other type of pattern-interrupt that stops it all…
Former officer Tricia Small joins me in this episode, where she shares her intimate near-last moments on this earth, focused on ending her life while on duty, and her journey through adversity from that moment through today.
Tricia is now an integral part of Code 4 Northwest and its expansion to assist first and frontline responders across the state with a range o...
330: Cultural Competency and Crucial Context - for First Responder, Clinicians, Family, and More
"Culturally competent." The words get thrown around a lot in discussion, on mental health practitioner profiles, and first responder wellness trainer bios. But what does it mean, and what does it include?
In this episode, I am joined by Dr. Stacy Raymond and Lt. David Dachinger (ret.) as we delve into the mental health challenges faced by first responders and how cultural competence, innovative therapies like EMDR, and effective modeling can transform frontline mental health support.
We discuss their book and resource being not only an expansive resource for first responders, but the clinicians who see...
329: The King Suffers, So Will the Kingdom. Ownership, Wellness, and Organization
In this episode, Eric explores the timeless lessons from the legend of the Fisher King to highlight the importance of personal and organizational wellness. He emphasizes ownership, self-regulation, and the impact of morale on leadership and team performance.
Key Elements:
The legend of the Fisher King and its relevance to leadershipThe impact of personal wellness on organizational healthStrategies for self-regulation and emotional managementThe role of morale in team performance and leadershipOwnership and responsibility in personal and professional lifeQuestions, topic ideas and feedback? Send a line!
To stay connected with the latest...
328: The Leadership Forge: Culture by Design w/ Chief Doreen Jokerst & Major Zach Stephens
This episode explores the critical role of intentional culture building within organizations, featuring insights from Chief Doreen Jokerst and Major Zach Stevens. Topics include leadership development, fostering psychological safety, and practical strategies for creating a positive organizational environment.
Chief Jokerst is a founding member of The Curve, focused on modernizing policing. Major Stevens is leading the way with hands-on regional leadership models that develops and mentors team members with a true coaching perspective.
Key topics:
The importance of intentionality in culture buildingLeadership development and mentorship programsCreating psychological safety in teamsThe role of everyday interactions in...327: Lincoln on Leadership: Key Strategies and Tactics, Book Review
"Lead by being led."
In this conversation, Eric reviews the book 'Lincoln on Leadership' by Donald T. Phillips, exploring the leadership principles exemplified by Abraham Lincoln during one of the most tumultuous times in American history.
The discussion highlights key concepts such as the importance of values, flexibility, persuasion over coercion, maintaining hope, engaging with public opinion, empowering teams, and the role of compromise in effective leadership. Eric emphasizes that these lessons are applicable across various fields and industries, making them relevant for leaders at all levels.
Lincoln was known for his high integrity a...326: Real Responder Resources: What's Next? w/ Code 4 NW, Nick Bauer & Andy McCurdy
Who helps the helpers? This is a question that organizations like Code 4 Northwest has been working to answer since before I started in this career nearly two decades ago.
If you didn't know much about first responder wellness or mental health resources, if you were in Washington, you knew about Code 4 NW. In this episode, I am joined by Nick Bauer (retired Seattle PD Sgt) and returning guest Chief Andy McCurdy. We talk about the new chapter we are moving into with statewide efforts and true real action for first responder resources.
We explore how Cod...
325: MORE Hiring Q&A for Police and Public Safety Careers
In this quick episode, I answer questions that help entry-level applicants and those testing for special unit selection as well as promotions. We cover interview tips and written test insights!
For more information check out other episodes and go to bluegritwellness.com/shop for an extensive guide for testing - so you can learn each step of the process in detail AND how to prepare.
Questions, topic ideas and feedback? Send a line!
To stay connected with the latest and exclusive content:
Subscribe to the FREE newsletter at on b...
324: Police & Purpose - through Unrest, Loss and the Grind, w/ Capt. Kory Flowers
The past few years highlighted many police leaders hanging up the badge - often with their sharing about how it just wasn't worth it anymore. I'm glad to be able to connect with and feature Captain Kory Flowers, who shared his enthusiasm and pride in the profession, despite what he, his team, and our industry endured. I greatly appreciated reflecting on how we are strong, not simply in spite of adversity, but BECAUSE of the adversity.
Captain Kory Flowers shares insights on maintaining purpose, resilience, and positivity in policing amidst challenges like social unrest, personal loss, and th...
323: GOOD GRIT: Reality of Resilience, Donna Brown Returns - Responder Advocate & Trainer, Author, Police Sgt. ret.
I am grateful to premiere the new GOOD GRIT series, focused on people doing genuinely GOOD stuff out there in the community. Who better to kick this off than returning guest Donna Brown, mental health advocate, trainer and retired police sergeant?? (from ep. 32!)
Donna, a retired homicide detective and author, shares her insights on resilience, identity, and the importance of gratitude in navigating life's challenges. Donna’s experience as a first responder, her reflections on mental health, and some of her own health challenges and reflections are shared to help us gain pause, presence, and clarity. Her comm...
322: The REAL Gift of Gab to Build Police Teams and Save Lives w/ Alex Mann
In this engaging interview, Alex Mann shares insights on the art of communication, de-escalation, and adaptability in policing, drawing from his 28-year career and unique experience in improv comedy. Discover practical techniques for effective community engagement, the importance of flexibility, and how humor can be a powerful tool in law enforcement.
The Importance of Communication in Policing
Improv and Humor as De-escalation Tools
Redefining Winning in Policing
The Art of Adaptability in Policing
Real-World Application of Improv Techniques
Acknowledging Reality and Building Trust
Leadership Through Collaboration and Humility
The Power...
321: No More Performance Evals? Why they aren't Effective and What to do Instead, w/ Chief Scott Hughes
We all know evals are generally ineffective. They're check boxes, and often don't reflect objectively across the ranks.
In this conversation, Chief Scott Hughes discusses the importance of mentorship, effective evaluations, and the need for a cultural shift in law enforcement. He emphasizes the significance of regular check-ins and positive recognition to build trust and motivate officers. The discussion also touches on the challenges of traditional performance evaluations and the role of body cameras in providing a more holistic view of officer performance. Ultimately, Hughes advocates for self-reflection and leadership that prioritizes the well-being of officers and t...
320: Ask for Help & Lose your Job? Confidentiality, Therapy Types, Sleep, L&I for First Responders, Police and Military w/ Drs. Thalia Nicholson & Larissa Tate
In this conversation, Dr. Thalia Nicholson and Dr. Larissa Tate discuss the mental health challenges faced by first responders and veterans, specifically the hurdle of reaching out for help, fearing loss of badge, job, clearance, and more.
They emphasize the importance of evidence-based treatments, the role of rapport in therapy, and the nuances of confidentiality. The discussion also covers the significance of sleep health and the barriers to seeking help, providing listeners with actionable insights and resources for mental wellness.
02:09: Meet the Experts: Dr. Thalia Nicholson and Dr. Larissa Tate
05:34: Understanding Therapy: Beyond S...
319: What's Hurting and Helping Police and Community: Chaplain Panel Perspective, w/ Jared Altic and Matt Domyancic
"Pain shared is pain divided."
This conversation delves into the multifaceted role of chaplains in supporting first responders, particularly police officers. I'm joined by chaplain GREATS- Jared Altic (Hey Chaplain! podcast) and returning guest, Matt Domyancic (Tactical Chaplain fmr. police officer). The insights go far beyond chaplain topics, but they afford us a unique view from their care for community and officers alike.
The discussion highlights the importance of building trust, the difference between proactive and reactive chaplaincy, and the essence of unconditional love in support. Both chaplains share their experiences and insights on how to...
318: Are you ready for FIFA World Cup?! (And other Major Event Planning, Public Safety, Emergency Management)
FIFA World Cup will prove to be the largest sporting event the USA has ever seen, and this will occur in just weeks. This is the sentiment shared from not only commentators and experts in world events, sports, geo-political arenas, but public safety and emergency management leaders across the nation.
This episode explores the complexities of planning for large-scale international events like the FIFA World Cup, featuring insights from Emergency Manager of Arlington, TX Irish Hancock and Adam Saynuck from Activu. Whether you are finishing up your own agency's FIFA prep or want tangible insights for major ev...
317: New Tools for Nervous System Regulation w/ Emily Ireland and Light Touch
You carry the weight of the job in your body, whether you feel it or not. (When you feel it.. you know it!) The nervous system doesn't forget a shift... it keeps score. Today's episode is about what happens when you stop white-knuckling through it and actually give your body a way out. We're talking craniosacral therapy, wellness tech, and the science of a nervous system that's been running hot for too long. This one's for the responder who sleeps like garbage, tries to think and perform through the fog, and wonders why "trying harder" isn't cutting it.
...
316: Beyond Generational Talk, but what Police Leaders Need to DO about It! w/ Will Akin, Bill Fraass, & Tyler Comeaux
This conversation explores far beyond the dynamics of generational differences in the workforce, but what responsible police leaders need to know and do about it all. We go into communication, motivators, and succession and strategic planning insights for crucial operations.
Joining me are three police leaders who have done thorough research and work on the topic: Sheriff Will Akin, Capt. Tyler Comeaux, and ret. Capt. Bill Fraass. The panel discusses the importance of understanding communication gaps, the need for empathy and value in leadership, and the significance of mental health and wellness. They emphasize the necessity of a...
315: First Responder Panel: Identity Pitfalls, Lessons and Tips (pt.2) w/ Megan Amaturo, Rich Creamer, David Smith
(Part 2 of 2!) In the demanding world of first responders, the concept of identity plays a crucial role in shaping how individuals perceive themselves and their roles. This podcast episode dives deep into the complexities of identity within the first responder community, featuring insights from experienced professionals who share their journeys and the challenges they face.
Host Eric opens the discussion with the observation that identity is a pervasive theme in the lives of first responders. He notes that while there is often a strong camaraderie within the profession, it can lead to an overwhelming sense of identity...
314: First Responder Panel: Identity Pitfalls, Lessons and Tips (pt.1) w/ Megan Amaturo, Rich Creamer, David Smith
In the demanding world of first responders, the concept of identity plays a crucial role in shaping how individuals perceive themselves and their roles. This podcast episode dives deep into the complexities of identity within the first responder community, featuring insights from experienced professionals who share their journeys and the challenges they face.
Host Eric opens the discussion with the observation that identity is a pervasive theme in the lives of first responders. He notes that while there is often a strong camaraderie within the profession, it can lead to an overwhelming sense of identity tied solely...
313: The Threats Beneath the Surface.. Protecting our Protectors, with Ray Lankin
According to the American Heart Association, nearly 50% of American adults over 20 have cardiovascular disease. For first responders, the risks are even higher. Worse, research shows that law enforcement officers have a 56% increased risk of dying from heart attacks between ages 55 and 59.
First responders are often celebrated for their bravery and commitment, but what about the hidden threats they face? While we frequently discuss visible dangers like accidents and violence, the psychological and physiological stressors that lurk beneath the surface require urgent attention. In this discussion with Ray Lankin founder of United Diagnostic Services, we will explore the...