Making Gay History

When Lou Sullivan sought gender-affirming care in the 1970s, he was turned down. The reason? Lou identified as a gay man at a time when all trans people were assumed to be straight—a conflation of gender identity and sexual orientation that Lou made it his mission to dismantle. Visit our ⁠episode webpage⁠ for background information, archival photos, and other resources, as well as a transcript of the episode. ——— Audio source: Louis Sullivan interviews #1, #2, and #4, GLBT Historical Society Film & Video Collection (GLBT-VIDEO), courtesy of the Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual, Transgender Historical Society. ———

“Are you gay?” a reporter asked U.S. Representative Barney Frank in 1987. “Yes, so what?” With that, Frank became the first member of Congress to voluntarily come out as gay. But the casualness of his reply hid decades of agonizing and a very real fear of torpedoing his political career. Visit our ⁠episode webpage⁠ for background information, archival photos, and other resources, as well as a transcript of the episode. ———

Nancy May’s allyship was as personal as it was political. After all, she was married to a gay man. In 1965, her involvement in San Francisco’s homophile movement placed her at the center of a headline-making face-off between the police and the city’s LGBTQ community.    Visit our ⁠episode webpage⁠ for background information, archival photos, and other resources, as well as a transcript of the episode. ———

Raised in a religious home in 1920s and ’30s Texas, Jim Kepner pieced together a sense of his identity where he could—a homoerotic suggestion read between the lines here, a secretly acquired booklet there. His collection of gay-themed materials grew into the largest LGBTQ archive in the world. Visit our ⁠episode webpage⁠ for background information, archival photos, and other resources, as well as a transcript of the episode. ———

Pat Bond joined the Women’s Army Corps in 1945, driven by patriotism and a desire to be among lesbians. The war required bodies, so the U.S. military turned a blind eye to service members’ sexual orientation. But as Pat witnessed firsthand, once WWII was won, the anti-gay witch hunts began. Visit our ⁠episode webpage for background information, archival photos, and other resources, as well as a transcript of the episode. ——— Audio source: Oral history interview between Pat Bond and Allan Bérubé, September 30, 1990, World War II Project Papers (collection no. 1995-16), courtesy of the Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual, Transgender Historical Society. ———...

Mabel Hampton was a performer and domestic worker who lived as an out lesbian in New York City from 1920 until her death in 1989. Her recorded oral histories offer a rare firsthand account of Black lesbian life during the Harlem Renaissance. Visit our ⁠episode webpage⁠ for background information, archival photos, and other resources, as well as a transcript of the episode. ——— Audio source: Mabel Hampton Oral History Collection, used by permission of the Lesbian Herstory Archives. ——— To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

When news broke in 1952 that Christine Jorgensen, an ex-GI from the Bronx, had undergone gender-affirming surgery, she became a global sensation. In this 1957 interview, meet the thoughtful woman behind the frenzied headlines as she took on the burden of educating the public about trans people. Visit our ⁠episode webpage⁠ for background information, archival photos, and other resources, as well as a transcript of the episode. ——— Audio source: Christine Jorgensen Reveals, an LP recording of a 1957 interview between Christine Jorgensen and Nipsey Russell (credited as R. Russell), released in 1958 by J Records, New York, NY. ——— To learn more about listener data and our privacy...

MGH is back for another dive into the archives! Drawing from Eric’s own collection of rare interviews and other repositories of LGBTQ history, we’ll bring you the voices of seven LGBTQ change-makers and allies whose stories will take you from 1920s Harlem to the halls of power in 1980s D.C.  ——— Audio sources: - Christine Jorgensen Reveals, an LP recording of a 1957 interview between Christine Jorgensen and Nipsey Russell (credited as R. Russell), released in 1958 by J Records, New York, NY. - Mabel Hampton Oral History Collection, used by permission of the Lesbian Herstory Archives. - Barney Frank interview v...

Today, the National Trust for Historic Preservation designated the Stonewall National Monument in NYC as one of America’s "11 Most Endangered Historic Places." As an antidote to the threat of erasure facing the country’s only national monument dedicated to LGBTQ+ history, MGH is re-releasing its season about the Stonewall uprising with the support of the National Trust for Historic Preservation and the National Parks Conservation Association. MGH's Stonewall 50 season first aired in June 2019. Visit our ⁠season webpage⁠ to access background information, archival photos, and other resources, as well as episode transcripts.  ——— To learn more about listener data and our privacy practic...

In this final episode, we reflect on why there are so few testimonies from LGBTQ people who survived the Nazi era and on the responsibility we have to honor the testimonies we do have in the face of the unfolding dark times here at home. Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— -Audio of the 1990 interview with Josef Kohout used by permission of QWIEN, the Center for Queer History in Vienna.  -The Josef Kohout book excerpt is from Heinz Heger’s The Men w...

Charismatic German Jewish athlete Fredy Hirsch dedicated himself to inspiring and protecting children imprisoned by the Nazis. In this episode, survivors of Theresienstadt and Auschwitz whose lives were made tolerable, sometimes even joyful, thanks to his selfless efforts share their memories. Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— -The following interview segments are from the archive of the USC Shoah Foundation – The Institute for Visual History and Education:  Dina Gottliebova-Babbitt, © 1998 USC Shoah Foundation  Michael Honey, © 1997 USC Shoah Foundation  Peter Mahrer, © 1998 USC Shoah Foundati...

Kenneth Roman was 15 when the Nazis rolled into his Polish hometown. After they liquidated the Jewish ghetto to which he and his family had been confined, he was sent to a series of forced labor camps and finally a concentration camp, where a sadistic block elder made him his “batman.” Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— The interview with Kenneth Roman is from the archive of the USC Shoah Foundation – The Institute for Visual History and Education, © 1998 USC Shoah Foundation. For more info...

German Jewish survivor Margot Heuman attributed her survival of the Nazi concentration camps to her friendship with another teenage girl. It wasn’t until the end of her life that she confided in lesbian historian Anna Hájková about the intimate nature of the friendship. Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— The interview with Margot Heuman is from the archive of the USC Shoah Foundation – The Institute for Visual History and Education, © 1994 USC Shoah Foundation. For more information about the USC Shoah Fou...

Lucy Salani was assigned male at birth, so when she came of age she was conscripted into the Italian army. She soon deserted—the first of several daring escapes that eventually landed her in Dachau. She’s one of the only trans people to testify about their experiences in Nazi concentration camps. Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— Lucy Salani interview footage courtesy of Matteo Botrugno and Daniele Coluccini, directors of the 2021 documentary C'è un soffio di vita soltanto (A Breath of L...

After the 1942 deportation of his boyfriend, 19-year-old Jewish Berliner Gad Beck vowed to help others escape the same fate. He became a prominent resistance member and used his resourcefulness, sexual barter, and chutzpah to save fellow Jews from the Nazi murder machine. Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— RG-50.030.0361, oral history interview with Gad Beck, courtesy of the Jeff and Toby Herr Oral History Archive, United States Holocaust Memorial Museum, Washington, D.C. For more information about the United States Holoca...

When the Nazis invaded the Netherlands in 1940, 36-year-old conductor Frieda Belinfante disbanded her orchestra and dedicated herself to helping others. She forged IDs to save Jews from deportation and joined a resistance group that carried out a daring act of sabotage. Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— RG-50.030.0019, oral history interview with Frieda Belinfante, courtesy of the Jeff and Toby Herr Oral History Archive, United States Holocaust Memorial Museum, Washington, D.C. For more information about the United States Holocaust Memori...

In 1939, French teenager Pierre Seel had his watch stolen at a cruising spot in his hometown. When he reported the crime to the police, he was placed on a list of suspected homosexuals. Two years later, with the city now under Nazi occupation, he was summoned by the Gestapo. A note about language: the person featured in this episode refers to Roma people by the now offensive term gypsies. To stay true to the original French testimony, we’ve not updated that term in our voiceover translation.  Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the...

Polish teenager Stefan Kosinski was beaten, tortured, and sent to prison. His crime? He fell in love with a Viennese soldier serving in the German army. When the soldier was sent to the Eastern Front, Stefan sent him a love letter, which was intercepted by the Nazis. Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— RG-50.030.0355, oral history interview with Teofil (Stefan) Kosinski, courtesy of the Jeff and Toby Herr Oral History Archive, United States Holocaust Memorial Museum, Washington, D.C. For more i...

In our second introductory episode, we focus on life in the Nazi concentration camps and offer a glimpse into the experiences of LGBTQ people in occupied countries during WWII as we continue to set the context for the eight profile episodes to follow. Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— -The following interview segments are from the archive of the USC Shoah Foundation – The Institute for Visual History and Education:  Walter Schwarze, © 1997 USC Shoah Foundation  Kitty Fischer, © 1995 USC Shoah Foundation  For more informat...

In this first of two introductory episodes, hear how the walls closed in on LGBTQ people after Hitler came to power through the recorded and written memories of multiple queer people who witnessed or fell victim to the Nazis’ persecution. Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— -The interview segment of Bertram Schaffner is from the archive of the USC Shoah Foundation – The Institute for Visual History and Education, © 1998 USC Shoah Foundation. For more information about the USC Shoah Foundation, go here. -The...

Host Eric Marcus welcomes listeners to MGH’s “Nazi Era” series by going back in time to 1980 and a darkened Broadway theater where his interest in LGBTQ Holocaust history was kindled. Join Eric as we embark on a 12-episode journey and honor Holocaust Remembrance Day. Visit our episode webpage for a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— -1993 interview with Pierre Seel courtesy of Là-Bas Si J'y Suis.  -RG-50.030.0019, oral history interview with Frieda Belinfante, courtesy of the Jeff and Toby Herr Oral History Archive, United States Holocaust Memorial Museum, Washington, D...

Frank Kameny lived by three rules: have absolute confidence in your beliefs; fight for what’s right; never, ever give up. Let them be a battle cry in these dark times. Visit MGH’s webpage for the original 2016 episode featuring Frank Kameny for background information, archival photos, and other resources, as well as the episode’s transcript.  ——— To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

In 1983 Evan Wolfson wrote a law school thesis that asserted that gay people had a constitutional right to marry. Thirty-two years later, the U.S. Supreme Court affirmed as much. In this guest episode from But We Loved, get to know the man behind one of the biggest victories in the history of the LGBTQ civil rights movement.  Learn more about Evan Wolfson and the Freedom to Marry campaign here. Find more episodes of But We Loved, a production of iHeartPodcasts and the Outspoken Podcast Network, here or on your favorite podcast platform. ——— To learn more about listener data and our pri...

Like so many other acts of LGBTQ resistance, the 1969 Stonewall riots could have become a footnote in history. But the protests and organizing that followed launched a new phase in the fight for LGBTQ rights. Hear how anger found its voice and how joy propelled the first Pride marches. First aired June 20, 2019. Visit our episode webpage for background information, archival photos, and other resources, as well as the episode’s transcript.  To hear more from Craig Rodwell, go here. And listen to Barbara Gittings and Kay Lahusen here as they discuss how homophile activists fared in the heady days of pos...

The Stonewall uprising began in the early morning hours of June 28, 1969. Revisit that moment, and the hours and days that followed, with voices from the Making Gay History archive. Relive in vivid detail the dawning of a new chapter in the fight for LGBTQ rights.  First aired June 13, 2019. Visit our episode webpage for background information, archival photos, and other resources, as well the episode’s transcript.  To hear more of Marsha P. Johnson and Randy Wicker’s conversation about Stonewall, go here. And listen to Morty Manford’s account of the riots here. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our...

Conflict has context. In this first episode of Making Gay History’s Stonewall season, we hear stories from the pre-Stonewall struggle for LGBTQ rights. We travel back in time to the turbulent 1960s and take you to the tinderbox that was Greenwich Village on the eve of an uprising. First aired June 6, 2019. Visit our episode webpage for background information, archival photos, and other resources, as well as the episode’s transcript.  For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your...

Can historical and emotional truth coexist? For the 55th anniversary of the uprising, Eric and fellow LGBTQ history expert Ken Lustbader talk to Stonewall National Monument visitors and let a few myths slip by to uncover Stonewall’s moving resonance as a symbol of LGBTQ liberation and joy. This episode is a co-production of Making Gay History and the NYC LGBT Historic Sites Project, in partnership with the National Park Service. Visit our episode webpage for a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— To learn more about listener data and our privacy...

As a bookish lesbian growing up in working-class England, June Thomas developed an early love of bookstores. After moving to the U.S. in the 1980s, she found community in the feminist bookstores of the era, as she recounts in A Place of Our Own: Six Spaces That Shaped Queer Women's Culture. Visit our episode webpage for a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. Episode Art: The Old Wives’ Tales Collective, San Francisco, 1982: Carol Seajay, Pell, Sherry Thomas, Tiana Arruda, and Kit Quan. © 1982 JEB (Joan E. Biren).  ——— To learn more about listener d...

Valerie Reyes-Jimenez called it “The Monster.” That’s how some people described HIV and AIDS in the 1980s. Valerie thinks as many as 75 people from her block on New York City’s Lower East Side died. They were succumbing to an illness that was not recognized as the same virus that was killing young, white, gay men just across town in the West Village. At the same time, in Washington, D.C., Gil Gerald, a Black LGBTQ+ activist, saw his own friends and colleagues begin to disappear, dying out of sight and largely ignored by the wider world. In this guest ep...

Eric is joined in conversation by Dr. Laura Erickson-Schroth and Dr. Ilan H. Meyer to delve into the past and present of mental health for LGBTQ people.  They discuss historical stigma, the ramifications of the American Psychiatric Association’s declassification of homosexuality as a mental disorder 50 years ago, and shifting psychiatric understandings of LGBTQ mental health in relation to societal pressures and prejudice. They also explore the continued pathologization of trans people, and the barriers that exist to finding accessible, safe, and informed care.  The MGH episode about Dr. Magnus Hirschfeld mentioned in the episode can be found here. Visit our...

A half-century ago, millions of homosexuals were cured with the stroke of a pen when the American Psychiatric Association decided to change its diagnostic manual and remove homosexuality from the list of mental disorders.  In this episode, we journey through several milestones in the battle for gay liberation and acceptance as we focus on how the field of psychiatry defined, and distorted, what it meant to be homosexual. Homosexuality was officially classified as a mental disorder in the 1952 edition of the American Psychiatric Association’s Diagnostic and Statistical Manual, but the narrative that equated being gay with being mentally ill had...

In the 1950s, psychiatrists diagnosed all homosexuals with a mental illness, and the sickness label created new forms of oppression for gay people in America. The sickness label was pervasive and seemingly inescapable. Until 1973, according to the American Psychiatric Association’s Diagnostic and Statistical Manual (the DSM), homosexuality was a mental disorder. In this first episode of Making Gay History’s “Dismantling a Diagnosis” miniseries, you’ll hear testimony from Eric Marcus’s archive describing this dangerous diagnosis and how the label affected the lives of LGBTQ people in the 1940s, ’50s and '60s. We also explore the crucial role of psychi...

In 1978 Harvey Milk called on gay people to gather in D.C. the next year to protest the anti-gay campaigns of Anita Bryant and her ilk. Organizers were stymied by internal conflicts until Milk’s assassination galvanized them and a date for a national march was set. But would anyone show up? Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit ht...

Eric gets an A on his freshman sociology paper, “Marginal Man: The Alcoholic and the Homosexual.” But his sunny predictions for the future of the gay rights movement are met with skepticism from his professor. Mere weeks later, Anita Bryant launches her anti-gay “Save Our Children” campaign. Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Gay rights activists in NYC are first out of the gate to propose anti-discrimination legislation, confident it will sail through the City Council. Instead, they hit a wall of ignorance and bigotry. Meanwhile, 15-year-old Eric happens upon some revelatory literature in his dentist’s waiting room. Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

When Jeanne Manford’s gay son is badly beaten at a 1972 GAA protest, the shy elementary school teacher takes a stand. She cofounds the organization now known as PFLAG and launches a movement that harnesses the strength of our fiercest allies: parents and the other people who love us. Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adch

While activists are demonstrating, filing lawsuits, and pushing for anti-discrimination laws, 16-year-old Eric is on a ferry to Fire Island, a legendary gay refuge off Long Island, with his neighbor Rev. Mullen—a trip that would introduce him to a vivid slice of mid-1970s gay life, ready or not. Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. ——— To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastc...

The Stonewall uprising ignites an explosion of protests and organizing that transforms a small, often tentative homophile movement into a newly assertive national force that demands gay liberation and equality. In a Puerto Rico hotel pool, 12-year-old Eric experiences a transformation of his own. Visit our episode webpage for additional resources, archival photos, and a transcript of the episode. For exclusive Making Gay History bonus content, join our Patreon community. Episode art photo: Gay Liberation Front Poster Image (1970) by Peter Hujar. Credit: © 2023 The Peter Hujar Archive / Artists Rights Society (ARS), New York. ——— To learn more about listener data and our privacy...

The decade between Stonewall and the 1979 March on Washington lives in the shadow of the AIDS crisis and all that came after. In this six-part season, Eric Marcus explores the heady years of gay liberation and the backlash that followed against the backdrop of his own coming of age as a gay teen. ——— To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Known for her smashing parties, lighter-than-air soufflés, and comedic wit, Lucy Hicks Anderson never let anyone tell her how to live her life—not even the courts. When her gender was put on trial in the 1940s, the publicity around her case made her one the first documented Black transgender figures in American history. Find more Sidedoor episodes at si.edu/sidedoor or wherever you get your podcasts. For additional resources about Lucy Hicks Anderson, go here. ——— To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit htt...