The Business Times Podcasts
The Business Times Podcast Channel presents diverse perspectives, in-depth analysis and news covering career, business, markets, investing, current affairs and tech. Powered by the Journalism of The Business Times and Tech in Asia. Available on all your favourite audio and video content apps and at www.businesstimes.com.sg/podcasts Produced by BT Audio, thrive and Tech in Asia. The Business Times, SPH Media.
NEA Names Three More Haze Companies, Korea Pauses Rate Hikes and France Imposes Curfews After Weekend Riots
Headline news for October 20, 2026: Singapore’s NEA issues preventive notices to three more Indonesian companies linked to the haze bringing the total to ten. South Korea’s central bank is expected to pause rate hikes on Thursday with another move forecast for November. France imposes overnight curfews in Paris, Nice and Lille after its worst urban unrest in decades.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Claressa Monteiro ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Claressa Monteiro or Nicole Teo
Produc...
AI funding jitters erode Asian equities as record tech capex and earnings loom
Market news for October 19 2026: Asian equities slipped as soaring artificial intelligence funding needs and massive tech capital expenditure fueled investor caution. Despite upbeat Chinese economic data and falling oil prices, global markets remain defensive ahead of a crucial week packed with major corporate earnings.
Synopsis: Market Focus Daily is a closing bell roundup by The Business Times that looks at the day’s market movements and news from Singapore and the region.
Written by: Howie Lim ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Chai Pei Chieh & Claressa Monteiro
Produced by: BT...
Singapore Haze Eases Slightly, France Hit by Its Worst Unrest in Years and Trump Signals a Russia Sanctions Waiver
Headline news for October 19, 2026: Singapore’s haze remains in the unhealthy range across four of five regions with rain forecast to bring some relief today. France suffers its worst urban violence in years with at least 2,400 arrested and 1,000 police injured as riots and looting spread across Paris, Marseille, Lyon and Bordeaux. President Donald Trump signals a possible Russia sanctions waiver but says no final decision has been made.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Claressa Monteiro ([email protected])
Produced and edit...
Navigating retirement planning: Why cash is your riskiest asset
We're drowning in financial data yet starving for retirement confidence. Only 28 per cent of Singaporeans feel truly on track — and as the nation hurtles toward super-aged status, the margin for error is gone. Howie Lim sits down with Samuel Rhee, co-founder and group CIO of Endowus to dissect why sitting in cash is the riskiest bet you can make, why "starting with why" beats chasing the perfect investment, and the three metrics that actually matter.
Synopsis: Every Monday, The Business Times breaks down useful financial tips.
Highlights:
01:23 Capital shortage meets analysis paralysis
...
Higher for longer is testing Asia’s AI trade
TSMC posts a record US$23.5 billion profit — yet Asian tech hardware gets crushed. Memory chips plunge 11 per cent. Credit default swaps for AI investors like SoftBank and CoreWeave widen to record highs. Meanwhile, the Strait of Hormuz stays in limbo, oil markets juggle ceasefires and tanker attacks, and the Kospi suffers its sharpest drop in months. Are we watching the moment debt-fueled AI expansion hits a wall? Oriano Lizza from CMC Markets joins Howie Lim to find out in Market Focus Weekly.
Highlights:
01:52 TSMC's record profit vs. Asia's tech wreck
02:48 CXMT Rising; chip ga...
Two Singapore-Listed Palm Oil Firms Reportedly Linked to Haze-Causing Fires; Indonesia Accepts Foreign Assistance; Ukraine Hits Russian Refinery
Headline news for October 16, 2026: Singapore is investigating which companies may be responsible for fires causing the haze, and will explore joint action with other countries. A report highlighted two Singapore-listed palm oil companies that have been linked to Indonesian plantation areas where fires were detected. Indonesia has accepted foreign assistance to fight forest fires, with arrangements now being discussed at the technical level. And Ukraine struck a Russian oil refinery overnight, after President Volodymyr Zelenskiy abandoned an energy-site ceasefire proposed by the US.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business T...
High rates meet AI's reality check as tech stocks and Asian markets tumble
Market news for October 15 2026: Tech stocks and Asian markets tumbled as rising interest rates collided with heavy AI infrastructure investments. Wall Street declined following hot US inflation data. Despite broader market routs, TSMC posted record quarterly profits while investors awaited key Federal Reserve insights.
Synopsis: Market Focus Daily is a closing bell roundup by The Business Times that looks at the day’s market movements and news from Singapore and the region.
Written by: Howie Lim ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Chai Pei Chieh & Claressa Monteiro
Produced by: BT...
Singapore Weighs Action Against Haze Polluters; Singapore-Flagged Ship Sinks in Hormuz; China-North Korea's Long-Delayed Bridge Opens
Headline news for October 15, 2026: Singapore could take action against companies responsible for haze pollution as air quality remains unhealthy across the island. A Singapore-registered container ship has sunk, and a second was damaged after being hit by projectiles in the Strait of Hormuz. And a long-delayed bridge linking China and North Korea is set to open today, in efforts to boost trade between the two countries.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Nicole Teo ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Cl...
Asian shares bounce on AI tech relief, oil gains curb optimism
Market news for October 14, 2026: Asian equities rebounded as bargain-hunting in AI tech stocks offset previous losses. However, persistent oil supply anxieties and cautious sentiment ahead of crucial US inflation data capped broader market gains.
Synopsis: Market Focus Daily is a closing bell roundup by The Business Times that looks at the day’s market movements and news from Singapore and the region.
Written by: Howie Lim ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Chai Pei Chieh & Claressa Monteiro
Produced by: BT Podcasts, The Business Times, SPH Media
Produced wi...
Singapore Beats GDP Forecasts, Iran Targets Oil Prices and BofA Fined US$1.2 Billion
Headline news for October 14, 2026: Singapore’s economy grows 5.4 per cent in Q3 beating forecasts as MAS surprises markets by pausing its tightening cycle after two moves this year. Iran deploys new Hormuz tactics to keep oil prices elevated ahead of US midterm elections. Bank of America is fined US$1.21 billion for suspicious transaction failures.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Claressa Monteiro ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Claressa Monteiro or Nicole Teo
Produced by: BT Podcasts, The Busine...
Asian chipmaker rout sparks broader AI trade rethink
Market news for October 13 2026: A sharp selloff in Asian chipmakers sparked a broader AI trade rethink amid rising Chinese competition. Regional stocks plunged, bond yields slid, and crude holding near high levels kept markets cautious as earnings loom.
Synopsis: Market Focus Daily is a closing bell roundup by The Business Times that looks at the day’s market movements and news from Singapore and the region.
Written by: Howie Lim ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Chai Pei Chieh & Claressa Monteiro
Produced by: BT Podcasts, The Business Times, SPH Medi...
Riyadh Airport Remains Closed After Week of Attacks, Singapore Haze Persists and Smartphone Shipments Hit a 14-Year Low
Headline news for October 13, 2026: Riyadh’s King Khalid International Airport remains closed after a week of attacks kills at least twenty people and wounds more than three hundred, the deadliest sustained assault on Saudi Arabia since the Iran war began. Singapore’s haze remains in the unhealthy range as Indonesia orders more action on land fires. Global smartphone shipments fall to their lowest third-quarter level since 2012.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Claressa Monteiro ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Claressa...
The age of longevity? Endowment-style investing for generations
What if you could live to 140? The real question isn't just how to get there — it's how to fund it. In this episode of WealthBT, Genevieve Cua sits down with Victor Aerni, CEO of Pictet Wealth Management Asia, to unpack the investment implications of radical longevity. From the endowment model pioneered by Yale to the hidden power of private equity, discover why diversification is still the only free lunch in investing — and why time, not timing, is the greatest advantage you have.
Synopsis: Learn to protect and grow your wealth in this monthly Business Times podcast series for...
Tech valuations tested as oil slippage sparks market erraticism
Market news for October 12 2026: Tech valuations face a critical test as earnings season opens, while oil prices slide amid supply uncertainty. Asian equities showed mixed results, European currencies weakened, and gold edged higher as global bond markets remained under pressure.
Synopsis: Market Focus Daily is a closing bell roundup by The Business Times that looks at the day’s market movements and news from Singapore and the region.
Written by: Howie Lim ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Chai Pei Chieh & Claressa Monteiro
Produced by: BT Podcasts, The Business Time...
Trump announces Russia-Ukraine energy ceasefire, One killed in Riyadh airport attack, Singapore rolls out subsidies to treat haze-related conditions
Headline news for October 12, 2026: US President Donald Trump announces an immediate energy ceasefire between Russia and Ukraine. 1 person has been killed and 11 others injured, in an attack on Saudi Arabia’s Riyadh international airport. And Singaporeans can start to receive subsidised care at polyclinics and participating GP clinics for treatment for haze-related conditions.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Nicole Teo ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Claressa Monteiro or Nicole Teo
Produced by: BT Podcasts, The Business Times...
Beyond the black box: Inside a glass-box approach to Asean investing
Markets are loud. Your strategy doesn't have to be. In this episode of Money Hacks, Howie Lim speaks to BlackRock strategist Filip Mena Berlin to pull back the curtain on systematic active equities — not a black box, but a glass box where data, discipline, and human judgment converge.
Discover why Asean is the diversification trade most portfolios are missing, how sentiment data reveals who you're really trading against, and why the best investors don't try to time markets — they outlast them.
Synopsis: Every Monday, The Business Times breaks down useful financial tips.
Highlights:
<...Singapore’s bank sell-off: A reset in expectations, not fundamentals
The STI just suffered its sharpest two-session rout in months, led by a sudden sell-off in Singapore's banking giants. Profit-taking or something deeper? With US 10-year yields above 5 per cent competing directly with dividend equities, S-Reits squeezed by rising borrowing costs, and institutions quietly rotating into industrials and semiconductors — the question isn't whether growth exists, but which companies can actually convert it into earnings. Geoff Howie, market strategist at SGX, joins us to separate signal from noise.
Highlights:
01:07 Reset in expectations, not fundamentals
04:14 Have bank net interest margins peaked?
08:10 S-Reits: the fo...
Washington Rules Out Iran Strikes Before Midterms, Singapore PSI Hits a Year-High and Europe Pushes Back on Chinese Trade Practices
Headline news for October 9, 2026: Washington rules out military strikes on Iran before the November third midterm elections as Tehran reviews the latest US peace proposal. Singapore’s PSI hits one hundred and seventy in the central region, the highest of the year as the Formula One weekend begins. Forty-four European industry associations urge the EU to act against Chinese trade practices ahead of next week’s Brussels summit.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Claressa Monteiro ([email protected])
Produced and edited...
Tech debt and Gulf shipping attacks send Asian equities sliding
Market news for October 8 2026: Tech debt sales and Gulf shipping attacks sent Asian equities sliding, while oil prices jumped and Treasuries faced pressure. Soaring yields buoyed the dollar, the euro hit 17-month lows, and corporate borrowing added to global sovereign bond market stress.
Synopsis: Market Focus Daily is a closing bell roundup by The Business Times that looks at the day’s market movements and news from Singapore and the region.
Written by: Howie Lim ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Chai Pei Chieh & Claressa Monteiro
Produced by: BT Pod...
Houthis Kill Three at Saudi Airports, Singapore Haze Persists Before F1 and Hormuz Attacks Hit a War-High
Headline news for October 8, 2026: Houthis attack two Saudi international airports with three people killed and thirty-six wounded at King Khalid International in Riyadh and Abha airport as Yemen fighting escalates sharply. Singapore's PSI remains in the unhealthy range across all regions one day before the Formula One weekend begins. Hormuz tanker attacks hit their highest weekly count since the war began.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Claressa Monteiro ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Claressa Monteiro or Nicole Teo
<...Asian and European stocks slide as surging oil prices fuel global anxiety
Market news for October 7 2026: European stocks and the euro fell as Brent crude surged past $100 on Middle East tensions and supply disruptions. US Treasury yields climbed to multi-decade highs ahead of key auctions. Gold slipped on dollar strength, while investors awaited Federal Reserve minutes for fresh rate clues.
Synopsis: Market Focus Daily is a closing bell roundup by The Business Times that looks at the day’s market movements and news from Singapore and the region.
Written by: Howie Lim ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Chai Pei Chieh & Claressa Monteiro
...France's Biggest Student Protests, Marcos Arrives in Singapore and Japan Wages Rise for an Eighth Month
Headline news for October 7, 2026: France's biggest student protests in decades sweep the country with more than two hundred and fifty-six thousand on the streets, over six thousand arrested since the movement began, schools closed and one student loses a hand. Philippine President Marcos arrives in Singapore today. Japan's real wages rise for an eighth consecutive month.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Claressa Monteiro ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Claressa Monteiro or Nicole Teo
Produced by: BT Podc...
Asian markets lifted by Nasdaq record and soaring Nvidia shares; Treasury yields hit 24-year highs
Market news for October 6 2026: Asian stocks advanced after a tech-fuelled rally pushed the Nasdaq to a record close, boosted by soaring Nvidia shares. Concurrently, the euro touched 17-month lows amid French fiscal concerns, while US Treasury yields hit fresh 24-year highs today across markets.
Synopsis: Market Focus Daily is a closing bell roundup by The Business Times that looks at the day’s market movements and news from Singapore and the region.
Written by: Howie Lim ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Chai Pei Chieh & Claressa Monteiro
Produced by: BT...
DayOne Files for a Nasdaq IPO, Nvidia-backed Reflection AI Launches Beam and Spain Calls a Snap Election
Headline news for October 6, 2026: Singapore-headquartered DayOne Data Centers files for a Nasdaq IPO as revenue more than tripled year on year to US512 million dollars but losses widened sharply and sixty-nine per cent of revenue comes from a single unnamed customer. Nvidia-backed Reflection AI launches its first open-weight model targeting Chinese AI rivals. Spain calls a snap election for 29 November.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Claressa Monteiro ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Claressa Monteiro or Nicole Teo
Pr...
Tiong Woon Corporation: Big profits in heavy lifting
Crane owner Tiong Woon is reporting stronger earnings, boosting its capital expenditure and lifting its dividend. Its CEO Michael Ang and CFO William Tan sit down with BT’s Ben Paul to discuss the outlook for the company, and why the company’s shares are undervalued.
Highlights of the podcast:
03:50 Riding an investment spending boom
07:55 Expanded margins, bigger dividends
18:15 Globally ranked and publicly listed
21:28 “Not sexy”: Closing the valuation gap
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Send your questions, thoughts, story ideas, and feedback to [email protected].
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...Asian stocks rally as Fed rate hike bets cool while Euro hits 17-month low
Market news for October 5 2026: Asian stocks rallied as Fed rate hike expectations cooled, while the euro hit a 17-month low amid French fiscal concerns. US Treasury yields held steady, oil prices eased, and Foxconn posted robust third-quarter revenue driven by strong artificial intelligence demand.
Synopsis: Market Focus Daily is a closing bell roundup by The Business Times that looks at the day’s market movements and news from Singapore and the region.
Written by: Howie Lim ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Chai Pei Chieh & Claressa Monteiro
Produced by: BT...
Yemen Launches Major Offensive, Chinese AI Closes the Gap and Brazil Heads to a Presidential Runoff
Headline news for October 5, 2026: Yemen's internationally recognised government launches a major military offensive against the Houthis as the Houthis claim missile and drone strikes on Saudi Aramco sites in Riyadh though Saudi Arabia and Aramco have not confirmed the attacks. Chinese AI models now trail US rivals by just three per cent, the narrowest gap on record. Brazil heads to a presidential runoff on October twenty-fifth.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Claressa Monteiro ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Clar...
Is the 60/40 portfolio dead? Navigating rate hikes and oil shocks
With the Fed signalling persistent rate hikes and oil shocks stirring global markets, is your portfolio positioned to survive—or thrive? What do rising bond yields, stubborn inflation, and central bank manoeuvres mean for everyday investors? Is the traditional 60/40 portfolio dead? Should you pivot to gold, lock in fixed income, or look to Asian credit for refuge?
StashAway’s Stephanie Leung and Fullerton Fund Management’s Angus Hui join correspondent Howie Lim to decode hidden market risks, FX traps, and the institutional strategies you need to build bulletproof wealth today.
Synopsis: Every Monday, The Business Times...
10-year Treasury hits 5.3%, oil surges and gold stumbles: M&G's Vikas Pershad on a market under pressure
Global bond yields hit multi-decade highs as oil prices surge, raising concerns over inflation and interest rates. Are markets underestimating the risks of higher-for-longer rates and the AI investment boom? Nicole Teo speaks with Vikas Pershad, portfolio manager, APAC Equities at M&G Investments, about AI valuations, China’s equity opportunities, US-China technology restrictions, and fiscal pressures across Asia. As investors navigate market volatility, the region’s broader investment opportunities may lie beyond the AI rally.
Highlights:
03:53 Higher-for-longer bond yields and borrowing costs
04:48 Is AI capex being fully priced in?
09:11 Asian equi...
Singapore lose 6-0 to Malaysia in ASEAN Cup, President Prabowo's biggest Cabinet reshuffle, Trump suggests Iran links to Flydubai flight incident
Headline news for October 2, 2026: US President Donald Trump says Iran may have been involved in an incident aboard a Flydubai flight. Indonesian President Prabowo Subianto carried out his biggest Cabinet reshuffle to date And Singapore was eliminated from the FIFA ASEAN Cup yesterday after being defeated by Malaysia 6 to 0.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Nicole Teo ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Claressa Monteiro or Nicole Teo
Produced by: BT Podcasts, The Business Times, SPH Media
Pro...
Oil pullback eases bond panic as global yields touch multi-decade peaks
Market news for October 1 2026: US Treasury yields surged to multi-decade highs amid soaring energy costs and inflation fears, while Asian tech stocks rallied on strong AI demand. Although falling oil prices provided brief relief, investors remain cautious regarding potential Federal Reserve rate hikes.
Synopsis: Market Focus Daily is a closing bell roundup by The Business Times that looks at the day’s market movements and news from Singapore and the region.
Written by: Howie Lim ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Chai Pei Chieh & Claressa Monteiro
Produced by: BT Pod...
Pilot Tries to Crash Israel-Bound Flight, South Korea Breaks Export Records and HDB Prices Fall Again
Headline news for October 1, 2026: A pilot stabs his co-pilot and attempts to crash an Israel-bound flydubai flight carrying one hundred and seventy-four people — passengers overpower the attacker and the plane lands safely in Saudi Arabia. South Korea's exports hit a record monthly high in September, up eighty-three-point-five per cent. HDB resale prices fall for a third consecutive quarter.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Claressa Monteiro ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Claressa Monteiro or Nicole Teo
Produced by...
Global bonds wobble in worst month for years as AI hopes buoy stocks
Market news for September 30 2026: Global bonds face their worst month in years amid rising inflation and soaring energy costs from the prolonged US-Israeli conflict. Meanwhile, Asian stocks remain resilient and upbeat today, driven entirely by surging investor optimism and strong hopes in artificial intelligence.
Synopsis: Market Focus Daily is a closing bell roundup by The Business Times that looks at the day’s market movements and news from Singapore and the region.
Written by: Howie Lim ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Chai Pei Chieh & Claressa Monteiro
Produced by: BT...
US Exits Iraq After Two Decades, China's Factory Activity Rebounds and Oil Rises on Peace Talk Hopes
Headline news for September 30, 2026: US forces complete their withdrawal from Iraq today ending more than two decades of military presence after four thousand five hundred American deaths. Iran hails it as a victory while Iraqi security officials warn of a potential security vacuum. China's factory activity returns to growth in September after two months of contraction.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Claressa Monteiro ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Claressa Monteiro or Nicole Teo
Produced by: BT Po...
Surging oil and bond yields signal higher-for-longer interest rates
Market news for September 29 2026: Surging oil prices and rising US Treasury yields pressured stocks as markets braced for prolonged high interest rates. Australia raised rates to a 15-year high, while Anthropic’s $2 trillion valuation target highlighted high-stakes AI optimism amidst broader market headwinds.
Synopsis: Market Focus Daily is a closing bell roundup by The Business Times that looks at the day’s market movements and news from Singapore and the region.
Written by: Howie Lim ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Chai Pei Chieh & Claressa Monteiro
Produced by: BT Podcas...
Haze Hits Unhealthy Levels Across Singapore, Anthropic Warns of Existential AI Risk and Malaysia Repatriates Myanmar Nationals
Headline news for September 29, 2026: Singapore's PSI hits 155 in the central region as haze enters the unhealthy range. Anthropic warns IPO investors that advanced AI could pose catastrophic or existential risks to humanity dedicating eighty pages of its prospectus to risk factors. Malaysia begins repatriating fifteen hundred Myanmar nationals in the first phase of a five-thousand-person programme.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Claressa Monteiro ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Claressa Monteiro or Nicole Teo
Produced by: BT Po...
Making sense of financial numbers driving big-bucks real estate decisions
Get insights on the numbers driving property deals and decision making.
Are yields of Singapore properties too low? Does being green help improve a property’s valuation? Learn about how development stacks up versus reuse. Understand key metrics of Reits. Leslie Yee is in conversation with Professor Joseph Ooi of NUS.
Synopsis: Hosted by senior correspondent Leslie Yee, PropertyBT from The Business Times shares insights on all things Singapore property to help you on your property investment journey. Episodes feature views and insights from property analysts.
Highlights of the podcast:
01:40 Property va...
Global markets rattled by surging oil, rate hike fears as Asia stocks sink
Market news for September 28 2026: Global markets slumped as surging oil prices and growing rate hike fears rattled investors. With the US rejecting Iran’s Strait of Hormuz truce proposal, Brent crude climbed past $107, pressing bonds and sinking Asian equities amid heavy economic headwinds.
Synopsis: Market Focus Daily is a closing bell roundup by The Business Times that looks at the day’s market movements and news from Singapore and the region.
Written by: Howie Lim ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Chai Pei Chieh & Claressa Monteiro
Produced by: BT Podca...
Iran's Hormuz Proposal Rejected, CDL Unlocks $6 Billion and Middle East Crude Hits a War-Era High
Headline news for September 28, 2026: Iran's seven-day Hormuz reopening roadmap, announced at the UN General Assembly, was publicly rejected over the weekend but Tehran says it is still awaiting the formal response through Qatari mediators. CDL announces plans to unlock six billion Singapore dollars from non-core assets. Middle East crude exports rebound to their highest level since the war began.
Synopsis: A round up of global headlines to start your day by The Business Times.
Written by: Claressa Monteiro ([email protected])
Produced and edited by: Claressa Monteiro or Nicole Teo
Pr...
The psychology of financial clutter: why we accumulate bad investments
Your portfolio might be messier than you think. Most of us don't build investment strategies — we collect financial products the way we hoard old cables and orphaned keys in a kitchen drawer. In this episode of Money Hacks from The Business Times, Howie Lim talks with Bryan Low — wealth management head at KGI Singapore and NTU professor — about why we keep buying without a plan, how loss aversion traps us in bad positions, and the surprising upside of cutting your portfolio down to ten lines. If your financial life needs a clean-out, this conversation is your Marie Kondo moment.
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