Dirt Church Radio Trail Running
Trail running talk and banter, delving deep to gain insight and inspiration from interesting runners in New Zealand, Australia and the world. Learn more: dirtchurchradio.com
The 2026 Tussock Traverse | DCR AidStation 048
The Tussock Traverse and/or the Ring of Fire is an event that you must do. 100%.Â
We canât really jazz it up more than that. If you like a unique mountain-running adventure that is both a grassroots event and offers the most incredible scenery, and world-class trails. After a tough couple of years, 2026 saw the event organisers putting it all on the line again. Ali and Matt run through the weekend and all the experiences therein, including a two-part tale of one of the greatest sporting battles of the last two decades. excellent stuff.
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Paula Griffin- Through The 'Ferns Onto The Trails | Dirt Church Radio 365
Kia ora e te whÄnau. Paula Griffin is among the many professional athletes weâve spoken to over the years who have pivoted from their original sport to trail running. Paula Griffin is the first professional netballer weâve had on the podcast, so thatâs really something. Paula speaks to Ali Pottinger about her life in professional netball (including becoming a Silver Fern), her pivot to MMA (of course), and then, after a circuitous route through motherhood and partnership, onto the trails, where she found her passion for this wonderful sport and inspiration to support other mums who lov...
Girls & Boys | DCR AidStation 047
I donât know, man. Whatâs in a name after all? Weâre lucky enough that Mattâs youngest daughter isnât called Skipper or Queenie (both names he went in hard for). Trying to decipher the lore behind a trail name is hard enough, right? This week on the AidStation, Matt and Ali talk about everything. From monetizing gravel *spoiler alert* Donât do it! Salomon, weâre looking at you, to the end of the world, headlamps, hot bois, hot girls, trail crushes, and when is it too soon (or too late) to call a course change?? The Ai...
Jack Harris. Horizons | Dirt Church Radio 364
Kia ora e te whÄnau. In our sport, we often hear stories of when people found trail running. Seldom do we hear of moments where trail running found us. Jack Harris was, as he tells it, going through a bit of a hard time, and one day decided to go for a hike along the Routeburn Track. By happy circumstance, that hike coincided with the running of the annual Routeburn trail run. It would be neater, if not less fulfilling, to fall back on some trope like âthe rest is historyâ. And whilst itâs true that history is happe...
UnSatisfyed| DCR AidStation 046
On this weekâs AidStation, we have a most excellent conversation about the LoopHer relay in Riverhead, a 3, 6, or 12-hour female-only relay. We talk about the upcoming Tussock Traverse and Ring of Fire, and our unreasonable excitement to be involved. We discuss the chase for the Western States Endurance Run and whether the field should be deeper. Is there a place for a Sportiv-style event? Or should we leave it exactly how it is? We talk about how much is too much to tell your coach, and Matt shares an epic tale of woe that spanned 32 hours, time in th...
The 2026 Old Ghost Ultra Special | Dirt Church Radio 362
Kia ora e te whÄnau. This episode has been a long time coming. DCR has been wanting to get down to the mighty Old Ghost Ultra for years, and this year, Ali P made it happen. The stoke is evident in her retelling of the event. If that isnât enough, weâve got interviews with Race Founder and 2026 participant Phil Rossiter, Mr. Original Ben Kepes, Third-place runner Sarah Kearns, and iRunFar founder Mr. Bryon Powell. Brilliant Stuff. Â Dirt Church RadioâBest Enjoyed Running.
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The 2026 Tarawera Ultra Trail Special | Dirt Church Radio 361
Kia ora e te whÄnau. Holy Hecka, what a weekend with the filth, fury, and triumph of Tarawera Ultra Trail New Zealand by UTMB. Join Ali Pottinger and Matt Rayment for a wonderful conversation with some of the leading lights in our sport for our annual live showâamazing insights from Ruth Croft, Beth McKenzie, Dan Jones, Petter Engdhal, Sam Harvey, Hannah McCrae, Liam Mierow, and Emily Hawgood. We run down the results, dive into the DNF rates, stumble through our long weekends on the mic, and share what we took from this experience and the best things we...
Lucy Bartholomew, Tom Heath, and Wanaka Ultra | DCR AidStation 45
On this weekâs AidStation, we have the distinct pleasure of speaking with Race Director Tom Heath about the exciting new event on the calendar, Ultra Wanaka. Ali and Matt also speak to the most powerful returning champion, L. Bartholomew of Diamond Creek, Victoria, about her go-to Rotorua trails, Race week self-care, and the update on her Dad, Ash, after his recent stroke. Matt has been accused of many things, being discursive, even downright circumstantial, but one thing he has never been in the 8 years of DCR is speechless. Thanks, Lucy. Really. Â Excellent Stuff.
D...
Jackson Cole. Fight The Power | Dirt Church Radio 359
Kia ora e te whÄnau. What a way to kick off 2026 with this awesome conversation with Goat Tongariro winner Jackson Cole. Jackson spoke with Matt from his base in Missoula, Montana. We touched on the usual topics like training and racing. Still, the conversation primarily centered on Jacksonâs history and ethosâfrom Wellington to Colorado and beyond ârooted in adventure, the joy of experience, and a love for wild mountain terrain. He spoke about valuing the simplicity of running over gadget obsession, preferring to listen to his body and embrace what the day brings, and his love of a we...
The Goat Tongariro w/ Michael Sutton | DCR AIdStation
On this weekâs AidStation, we bring you an excellent chat Ali P had with Michael Sutton at The Goat Tongariro. Michael, if you will remember, has represented New Zealand multiple times at the World Mountain Running Championships, and has recently launched The Kea Mountain Running Series to bring the shorter, harder, vertier stuff to the people. You may also be familiar with Michael from his excellent conversation on episode 349 with Matt. Ali also catches up with 261 Fearlessâ Kate Southern on the start line for her first Goat adventure. In excellent news, we celebrate Andrew McDowallâs selection for the 202...
The 2026 Tarawera Ultra Trail Special with Kerry Suter | Dirt Church Radio 357
Kia ora e te whÄnau. Weâre back again for the third annual DCR Tarawera Ultra Trail by UTMB special. Joining Ali and Matt at the helm is a special guest, two-time Tarawera champion, and running coach extraordinaire, Mr Kerry Suter. What a treat you have in store for yourselves this episode, as we dive deep into the history of the event and its impact on the global running scene. We also talk about our own histories with the event and how something as elementally simple as a run through the woods has changed our lives in meaningful way...
Let the Runger Games Begin |DCR AidStation 43
Maybe we were all a bit too hopeful that 2025âs madness would not continue into 2026. Maybe these first two weeks are a post-credit scene, or maybe, just maybe, this is 2026 saying âhold my beerâ in response to last yearâs antics. Anyway you cut it, itâs probably best to get yourself out for a run. Itâll probably help.Â
The WTF?! quality of early â26 hasnât stopped at the door of the ultrasphere, so for our first AidStation of the year, Ali and Matt run down (see what we did there) all the hot takes, from green screens and...
Sam Harvey & Stephen Redfern | Dirt Church Radio Summer Series 002
Kia ora e te whÄnau. Welcome to the second of our DCR Summer Series episodes, where weâll be bringing you our most popular conversations from 2025. This week, weâve got a double header, throwing it back to July when Sam Harvey made his DCR three-peat and spoke to Andrew McDowall about (literally) running himself to a standstill as the assist in the world-record-breaking 118-hour/790 km knock at Dead Cow Gully. Then, we bring you Andrewâs conversation with Stephen Redfern. Stephen is notable for several reasons, including his ongoing feud with Andrew (Which is odd, as they are gre...
Jasmin Paris | Dirt Church Radio Summer Series 001
Kia ora e te whÄnau. Welcome to the first of our DCR Summer Series episodes, where weâll be bringing you our most popular conversations from 2025. Kickin' it off this week, we are taking it back to March, and episode 318, when Ali and Matt spoke to the one and only Jasmin Paris. Jasmin Paris entered the wider public consciousness when she became the first woman to finish the Barkley Marathons, with just 99 seconds to spare. Ironically, for a race that eschewed publicity for so long, the photos of her sprinting the final 100 metres to the yellow gate are now...
Damian Watson. Layer Upon Layer Upon Layer | Dirt Church Radio 355.
Kia ora e te whÄnau. The path to success is seldom simple. Itâs often multiple overlays of experience, each building upon the other until the goal is reached, be that setting course records at 200-mile events like the Wild Horse or becoming an expert pastry chef and deli owner. Damian Watson is someone with overlays of experience. Andrew McDowall travelled out to Muriwai Beach on Aucklandâs rugged West Coast to meet up with Watson at the Deli he co-owns with the Steel brothers for a run and yarn about what it takes to compe...
Live, Laugh, Love-Your-Mat-Time-Not-Your-Strava-Time, You Dorks | AidStation 42
Kia ora e te whÄnau. Itâs the last Aid Station of 2025, and we're in a reflective mood. Matt wishes he could run faster, Ali wishes she could move house automatically, and Andrew wishes he had feelings like a real boy. Apart from these aspirational goals, our heroes run down the year that was, listing what theyâve loved, learnt, and what they wish to take forward into 2026. Never free from the hottest of takes, we explore the qualitative vs. quantitative divide in this most terminally online trend: listing your Strava time, not your mat time, during races. We rou...
The 2025 Kepler Special | Dirt Church Radio 354
Kia ora e te whÄnau. In this week's second episode, join Andrew McDowall for the 2025 Dirt Church Radio Kepler live show. Andrew took up the baton from Matt and Eugene, journeyed down to Te Anau to host a vibrant live show, and then tackled the 60km Kepler Challenge the following dayâwhich, in typical AMCD style, he knocked out of the park. Settle into your long run this weekend, and enjoy Andrewâs conversation with Menâs and Womenâs 60km champions Dan Jones and Frances Redmond, Kepler Challenge chair Steve Norris, Nikki Everton, and DCR returning champion Daniele D...
The 2025 Spectacle Special | Dirt Church Radio 353
Kia ora e te whÄnau. If, as a winsome youth, youâd had your heart broken at a Swedish wedding in Nelson, what would it take to shift the unconscious response when the town was mentioned from âyeah, nahâ to âHell Yesâ? Turns out, a weekend packed with as much awesomeness as you could shake a stick at. Happily, we can report that this circumstance eventuated for Matt at the 2025 edition of The Spectacle. In this episode of DCR, join Ali P and Matt as they bring you their conversations with returning 100-mile champ, Reefton's favourite daughter (and Guinness Wor...
Ultra Trail Kosciuszko with Lucy Bartholomew| Dirt Church Radio 352
 Kia ora e te whÄnau. Join us for the first of three live specials as Ali heads off to the Snowy Mountains for the fourth edition of Ultra Trail Kosciuszko by UTMB. Featuring interviews with Running Mums Australia founder Nic Bunyon, The Honey Buzzard himself, Martin Gaffuri, DCR Fan and Kosci frother, Bel, and the incredible Lucy Bartholomew. Excellent Stuff.
Dirt Church Radio â Best Enjoyed Running.
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Episode LinksÂ
Ultra Trail Kosciuszko by UTM...
Inside the Wai2k- The Toughest Race In Town | Aidstation 41
 Kia ora e te whÄnau.Â
It turns out, the Wai2k is hard mahi. I mean, we always thought that, but to have our suspicions confirmed by AMCD as he valiantly sent it in the weekendâs 100km was oddly satisfying. Gareth Thomas builds hard races, as those who have had the pleasure of attempting the WUU2K will attest. To hear that compared the the WAI, the WUU is âa kidâs runâ apparently. AMCDâs pain is indeed our gain. This week, the gang debriefs Andrewâs most epic weekend, weâve got a sweet li...
Ruth Croft- Hail To The Chief| Dirt Church Radio 351
 Kia ora e te whÄnau. We want to invite all who can be upstanding to welcome one R. Croft of Greymouth back for her Tenth appearance on Dirt Church Radio. We are Ruth fans. If there was a RAT for it (Ruth Antigen Test), weâd be positive. Or is that CAT? (Croft Antigen Test?). ANYWAYS. Itâs been a minute since weâve talked to old mate, and after an abortive attempt post UTMB (Thanks, French Internet, you dork), Ali P gets together for a long overdue catch-up with Ruth about the year sheâs had, and what i...
100 miles is 100 miles is 100 miles| Aid Station 40
 Kia ora e te whÄnau.Â
Things we learned on this weekâs episode. We suck collectively at Maths, there is such a thing called a Wet Globe Bulb Temperature (WHAT?!?!?), We are all pro-Kipchoge winning Western States. Despite their relative masses, Andrew and Matt cope conversely in the heat (at least psychologically) and are aligned in our distaste of the UTMB kilometre effort industrial complex.Â
The gang is back together for the literal and figurative heat of the Grapianâs Peak Trail and Arrowtown Ultra. Join Mat...
Michael Sutton - Ainât No Mountain High Enough | Dirt Church Radio 349
 Kia ora e te whÄnau. Weâre baaaaack and beyond excited to bring to you Mattâs conversation with the most excellent Michael Sutton. The words âmountain,â âtrailâ and âultramarathonâ are somewhat interchangeable in the lexicon of the outdoors-themed pursuit. Michael Sutton, however, is the real deal. A 6 x NZ representing, 4:28 Mile running, Steeple chasing, sub three minute per km Mountain Machine. Matt goes to school with Michael and gets all the lore and in-and-outs about what sets the mountain apart from the trail in this most epic facet of our sport. Dirt Church Radio. Excellent Stuff.
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Helene Barron- Beyond The Finish Line | Dirt Church Radio 348
 Kia ora e te whÄnau.Â
Best laid plans and all thatâŚWe had a bumper episode lined up for you this week, with a lot of stuff to talk about, and an amazing GRE, that was even before we got to Andrewâs conversation with the mighty Helene Barron. Annoying story short, our entire episode got zoinked by the AWS outage. Perfect. So please enjoy this distilled episode of DCR, with the one and only Helene Barron, elite trail athlete, high-performance physiotherapist, coach, mother, wife, sister, friend, and legend. The trail exploits are but...
Shoey-Doo-ey-Do! | AidStation 41
Kia ora e te whÄnau.
Even by our standards, this episode of the DCR AidStation is a lot. Future Andrew makes a record number of appearances to preface, foreshadow, recommend, and otherwise act as a lexographical zamboni for Ali and Matt (we all know it is mainly Matt). From last weekâs epic TaupĹ Ultramarathon and some interviews Ali conducted whilst running, crewing, and slapping fives, to a lively debate about what is worse for you, port-a-loo stained grabbers sliding into nasty communal chippies for 100km vs drinking some beer out of a shoe. I guess ever...
Tanya Carroll- Iâm For The Trails | Dirt Church Radio 346
Kia ora e te whÄnau.Â
Did we compare Tanya Carroll to The Lorax in the title? Maybe. Is Tanya Carroll worthy of such an accolade? Yep. Tanya is for the trails. Having run over 100 trail events and over 45 ultra marathons, including 10 Ultra Trail Australia 100s and a couple of UTMBs (not to mention a stack of other amazing results). Tanya is currently the Oceania Operations Manager for Ironman Trail events, bringing her years of passion and expertise as a participant to the biggest stages. Tanya is legit. Sheâll go the extra mile for r...
One Year Of Three People | AidStation 040
Kia ora e te whÄnau.
We had a particularly nice time on this weekâs AidStation podcast, celebrating one year of Ali and Andrew jumping on board. Matt had the opportunity to ask them a mix of longer-form and quick-fire style questions about the last 12 months, and what they were looking forward to in the next 12 months and beyond.
If you are after an under-the-hood look at what makes the two ânewâ co-hosts of Dirt Church Radio tick, then dive in. Plus, Andrew from the future grabs interviews with 24 Hours of Blue Lake RD, Sarah S...
James Inwood vs. the Badwater 135 | Dirt Church Radio 344
Kia ora e te whÄnau. James Inwood is no stranger to challenge. The Greytown runner has completed numerous ultramarathons, including the infamous Coast to Kosci; however, nothing could have prepared him for the challenge of Badwater 135. 217 kilometers of road from Death Valley Basin, finishing on the road to Mount Whitney, the race starts at the lowest point in the contiguous USA and ends on the road to the highest. Brutal temperatures, tight cut-offs, massive crew requirements, and a finishing list that includes the legends of our sport- the Badwater 135 is an ultimate test of endurance. Andrew McDowall spoke t...
The Good,The Bad & The Ugly | Aid Station 39
Kia ora e te whÄnau. Mistakes were made. The first of many in this weekâs episode of the AidStation was Andrew McDowall describing Matt as having a âwater off a duckâs backâ mentality. This is not true. Especially when the water is the wider response to the Joyline Chepgnego doping saga.That water really sank in. The duck was soaked. . Ali, Andrew, and Matt discuss this thorny issue and where responsibility for supporting athletes accused of doping sits, and is the response from sponsors and the wider bodies in the sport is up to scratch. Furthermo...
Justin Grunewald - The Only Way Out is Through | Dirt Church Radio 342
 Kia ora e te whÄnau.
This week, Ali Pottinger speaks with elite ultra runner and physician Justin Grunewald. Fresh off a second-place finish at the Leadville 100, Justin talks to Ali about managing his life as a parent and doctor when his wife, Amanda Basham (DCR 311) is also an elite runner.Â
Justinâs story is intertwined with the loss of his first wife, Gabe Grunewald, to a rare form of cancer in 2019. Ali and Justin talk about living with grief, the Brave Like Gabe foundation, and how t...
Hail To The Chief | Aid Station 38
 Kia ora e te whÄnau. We make no bones about it. Dirt Church Radio is, was, and always will be Ruth Croft Positive. Over the (at least) 7 times Croft has appeared on DCR, there has always been one constant- a focus on moving forward. Ruth is on par with the best to take the gig, a wonderful human being, and an asset to our sport. The only criminal element? You arenât going to hear about her on the news back in little old NZ, which is probably how she likes it.Â
So if yo...
Sean Conwayâ Beard, Belief, and Bad-Assery | Dirt Church Radio 340
Kia ora e te whÄnau.
This week, Ali Pottinger and Matt Rayment speak to Sean Conway, the Zimbabwe-born, UK-based endurance adventurer whose life has been one long refusal to do things by halves. Seanâs palmarès reads like a dare whispered at closing time: cycling around the world, swimming the length of Great Britain, running across it, and then becoming the first person to complete a length-of-Britain triathlon. Heâs broken the world record for the most Ironman triathlons completed on consecutive days, and carved out a niche as one of...
For Those About To Rock, We Salute You | Aid Station 37
 Kia ora e te whÄnau. Itâs that time of year when we start to see the end of winter and the earliest glimpses of spring. Thoughts turn to the new year, big events, and the lead-up to those events. Does one size fit all when it comes to peak months and loading during the macrocycle? This doesnât even begin to touch on the double-edged sword of Strava and the world of socials. Luckily, Andrew and Matt get to hang out each week with one of the best coaches in the business, our own Ali P....
Phil Gore â To Infinity And Beyond | Dirt Church Radio 338
Kia ora e te whÄnau.
 This week, Ali Pottinger and Andrew McDowall sit down with the one and only Phil Gore. Youâll know Phil from his two epic showdowns with our very own Sam Harvey at Dead Cow Gully â both times pushing themselves to the ragged edges of what we thought humanly possible.
This time, they didnât just flirt with the record â they obliterated it. Both sailed past the previous world mark, with Phil taking the win (and the record) in a staggering 119 yards. Before the race, there was talk of 150 yards (laps, for those...
The Olympics, Overtraining, and that F*%king Kelpie Dog I AidStation 36
Kia ora e te whÄnau. I mean, the co-hosts of your third favourite trail and ultrarunning podcast havenât gotten together for a chinwag for a while, and, if the universe has had a say in 2/3rds of our days, things are bound to get chaotic. Ultras at the Olympics, The legacy of Backyard Ultras, Overtraining and being Over Training, Plus Andrewâs bad ankle, Aliâs tumultuous toddler, and the dead dolphin under Mattâs house (really). Like a young lord patronised by a rich family we cover some ground on this weekâs AidStation. Also, does anyone...
Sage Canaday â Any Surface, Any Distance | Dirt Church Radio 337
 Kia ora e te whÄnau. This week, Ali and Matt sit down with the legendary Sage Canaday. Since turning pro in 2012, Sage has been a defining presence in the trail and ultrarunning world. With a strong background in road racing and tidy marathon times, he helped usher in a new era of professional athletes in trail running.
An outspoken advocate for clean sport, Sage has long used his platform not only to race but to educate, connect, and inspire. As both coach and athlete, he was an early ad...
Maree Connor â Spartathlon, Badwater, and Beyond | AidStation 35
Kia ora e te whÄnau. This week, weâve got another special edition of the AidStation for you. Ali and Andrew caught up with Australian endurance legend Maree Connor to talk about her amazing ultramarathon career. From the iconic Spartathlon to the punishment of Badwater 135 to the World 24-Hour Championships, Maree has conquered some of the most incredible races in our sport. We couldnât wait to bring you this conversation, so weâre putting it out as an AidStation special for you good people!
Dirt Church Radio â Best Enjoyed Running.
Marianne Hogan â The Will to Endure | Dirt Church Radio 335
Kia ora e te whÄnau. This week, Ali Pottinger catches up with the mighty Marianne Hogan. We first tried to record this conversation before Tarawera Ultra Trail, but a patchy internet connection and a tight schedule meant we had to hit pause.
Thankfully, weâve picked it back upâand what a time to do it. Marianne has just come off an epic third-place finish at this yearâs Western States Endurance Run, cementing her place as one of the sportâs leading talents. Her resilience and grit in the face of i...
Dan Jones. Western States Endurance Run And The Year Ahead- AidStation Special.
 Kia ora e te whÄnau. This week weâve something super special for you. Ali and Matt had the chance to catch up with Dan Jones about his third consecutive top-five finish at the Western States Endurance Run. We talk about the day that was, the lead up, his recovery, and whatâs in store for the coming year in this extra special edition of the DCR AidStation. Dirt Church Radio- Best Enjoyed Running.
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Sam Harvey and Stephen Redfern- To The Well We Go. Dirt Church Radio 333.
 Kia ora e te whÄnau. As the sport of trail and ultramarathon running evolves, we find ourselves searching for that extra 1%. Whether it's in efficiency and speed (just witness the spectacle of the elite aid stops at Western States) or pushing that bit further, it seems like we are heading towards uncharted territory. This week on Dirt Church Radio, we bring you two interviews with athletes who know how to go the Well. Sam Harvey makes his DCR three-peat this week and talks to Andrew about (literally) running himself to a standstill as the assist in the re...
