Work with Purpose: A podcast about the Australian Public Sector

On the fifth episode of our APS Reform in Action series, we hear from Laure Yassine and Lisa Jansen from Services Australia, and Carly Harrison from the Australian Public Service Commission, on the development of Services Australia's APS Experience Design Principles – and how you can apply them, even if you're not a design expert.

These seven principles – simple, inclusive, tailored, connected, transparent, safe, and trustworthy – help the APS design and deliver people-centred, inclusive services across all channels. Developed through extensive consultation and research, they offer practical guidance for improving both policy and service delivery.

Laure Yassin...

Our APS Reform in Action series returns with a deep dive into bringing stewardship to life in aged care across Australia’s regions.

In response to the Aged Care Royal Commission, the Australian Government invested over $13 million to tackle local challenges and service gaps in aged care through a local network of Department of Health, Disability and Ageing staff. Today, the network has an office in each capital city around Australia and nine regional offices, representing the department ‘on the ground’ to support the implementation of aged care reforms.

On this episode, host David Pembroke, CEO of...

On today’s episode of Work with Purpose, Danielle Wood, Chair of the Productivity Commission, reflects on how the Commission’s role has evolved—from her early days as a graduate to leading its national reform agenda.

As Australia faces slower growth and rising complexity, how can public policy adapt to deliver long-term productivity and social progress?

Danielle joins host David Pembroke, CEO of contentgroup, to discuss how the commission continues to provide rigorous, independent advice in the public interest while expanding its focus to the care economy, First Nations policy, and Closing the Gap. She al...

On this episode of Work with Purpose, Sean Innis, author of ‘Of(f) Course Minister’, talks about the principle of responsible government – how it has evolved, drifted and, at times, been corrupted.

As the dust settles from the 2025 Australian Federal Election, we take a deep dive into the ins and outs of the relationships between public servants, ministers, and parliament. These relationships may be complex, but at their core, they should be rooted in the principle of responsible government. But what does that actually mean?

This time, guest host Kate Driver, CEO of IPAA A...

On this episode, Michelle Steele from the Paul Ramsay Foundation talks us through community engagement from a philanthropic and public sector perspective, highlighting the value of listening instead of coming with solutions.

When governments engage with communities, it’s usually about a specific program or policy – but what if the first goal was to genuinely listen to the community’s broader needs?

On this episode of Work with Purpose, led by host David Pembroke, CEO of contentgroup, Michelle Steele, Chief First Nations Officer at the Paul Ramsey Foundation, draws on her experience working in the public...

On today’s episode of Work with Purpose, Andrew Walter from the Department of the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet and Professor Anne Tiernan from the McKinnon Institute for Political Leadership unpack the caretaker conventions.

The Australian federal election campaign is well underway – this means the Australian Public Service is now in caretaker mode. But what does this mean for the day-to-day work of public servants?

Host David Pembroke, CEO of contentgroup, speaks with Andrew Walter, first assistant secretary of the Government Division at PM&C, and Anne Tiernan head of research and Prof...

On this episode of Work with Purpose, we hear from Ray Griggs AO CSC about what working in the navy has taught him about taking and giving feedback, and why difficult conversations are part and parcel of becoming a better leader.

Ray Griggs AO CSC looks back at a long and distinguished career in the public sector – from Australia’s Defence Force to most recently the Department of Social Services. Along the way, he navigated many difficult conversations, had his views contested, and at times, had to manage failure. In this conversation with host David Pembroke, CEO of c...

Trigger warning: themes of mental health/sexual assault

Robin Edmonds from the Department of Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development, Communication and the Arts and Joey Ballantyne of Grit n Grace Collective talk about neurodiversity, developing a strong sense of self, and supporting people to learn and work in a way that helps them thrive.

When Joey Ballantyne, founder of Grit n Grace Collective, speaks about breaking the survive/burnout cycle, and her late autism diagnosis, it comes from the heart. Driven by her own experience, she started her own neuro-affirming professional development program, built...

On our second episode of our APS Reform in Action series, we hear from Lisa Bush and Maree Wilson from Geoscience Australia about the power of geospatial data for better decision-making in the public sector.

If you want to make better decisions, you need to have quality, trusted data. Unfortunately, critical data can often sit in siloes or be scattered across spreadsheets. Geoscience Australia’s Digital Atlas of Australia steps up to this challenge, providing a unified and accessible data set that can help you build better policies – or decide where you want to build your new home...

Returning for part 2 of our new ‘APS Reform in Action’ series, Dr Rachel Bacon and Professor Janine O’Flynn discuss how Australia is learning from other countries’ public service best practice – and vice versa.

Wanting to do things better doesn’t always mean you have to re-invent the wheel. In this episode, Dr Rachel Bacon from the Australian Public Service Commission and Professor Janine O’Flynn from ANU Crawford School reveal lessons from overseas and introduce the concept of ‘radical incrementalism’ – making small improvements to achieve a larger goal.

Host David Pembroke, CEO of contentgroup, als...

Launching our new ‘APS Reform in Action’ series, we hear from Dr Rachel Bacon and Professor Janine O’Flynn about enduring APS Reform and why public trust shouldn’t be taken for granted.

The APS Reform Agenda has been a major project for the Australian Public Service over the past years – so, where is it at and where will it go in the future?

Dr Rachel Bacon, deputy commissioner, Integrity, Reform and Enabling Services at the Australian Public Service Commission, and Professor Janine O’Flynn, director of the ANU Crawford School of Public Policy, refl...

On the first episode of Work with Purpose of the year, Dr Claire Yorke lifts the lid on empathy and why it matters for policy and programs.

Critics might say that empathy is a ‘soft skill’, yet it is absolutely critical to understanding people’s experiences and circumstances – and how they feel about them. It is also a key tool for better policy, programs, strategies, and leadership.

Dr Claire Yorke, senior lecturer at the Centre for Future Defence and National Security at Deakin University and host David Pembroke, CEO of contentgroup, explore why being em...

In our last re-run for this season, Matt Yannopoulos PSM, Associate Secretary of the Department of Defence, maps out a unified approach for the public service to defend Australia’s interests.

In a world with increasing geopolitical tension, collaboration across the public service remains key to protecting Australia’s security and prosperity. On this episode, David Pembroke, CEO of contentgroup sits down with Matt Yannopoulos PSM, Associate Secretary of Defence, to explore what it takes to do this well.

They delve into the importance of a whole-of-government approach, emphasising the need for speed, focu...

Trigger warning: themes of mental and physical abuse

Amaly Khalaf and Dr Steven Munns from the Australian Public Service Commission explore psychological safety in public sector workplaces – from the desk to the frontlines – on our third best-of episode of Work with Purpose 2024.

Creating workplaces which are both mentally and physically safe is a mission close to Amaly Khalaf’s and Dr Steven Munn’s hearts. On this episode of Work with Purpose, they talk to host David Pembroke, CEO of contentgroup, about how the public sector is working towards this – from exemplary and trustful l...

Today, we listen back to a 2024 Work with Purpose episode with Secretary of the Department of Health and Aged Care Blair Comley PSM. Blair tells the story of his public service career and highlights how devolving leadership in the public sector can reduce risk, increase work quality and staff satisfaction.

Blair Comley PSM looks back at an outstanding career across the public and private sectors, from designing the GST to driving the Department of Health and Aged Care’s recent capability review.

On this episode from June last year, he revisits some of th...

In this re-run of our most popular Work with Purpose episode of 2024, Dr Nina Terrey, Bec Bodel and Professor Brenton Prosser help you learn the ropes of human-centred design.

In today’s complex world, how can the public sector effectively ensure that its policies and programs are centred on the needs of the people they serve? This episode explores human-centered design as one piece to solving this puzzle.

In our first re-run of 2024’s best Work with Purpose episodes, host David Pembroke, CEO of contentgroup, convenes class with three leading experts in the desi...

Join us in unpacking the best conversations of Work with Purpose in 2024 – from tips for human-centred design to understanding how the public sector can join hands in defence of Australia.

As the year comes to a close, we listen back to some of our fantastic 2024 Work with Purpose guests, reflecting on the sector’s most pressing challenges, innovative ideas, and inspiring stories.

Presented by David Pembroke, CEO of contentgroup, our guests give us many gifts – tips on reimagining leadership and collaboration, navigating workplace safety, ethical governance, and innovation, and designing better programs and polici...

TW: mental health and suicide

On our first ever Work with Purpose live episode, we shine a light on men’s mental health – from the numbers to the stories behind them – with Matthew Short from the Department of Health, Matthew Breen from Running for Resilience, and Lachlan Vivian-Taylor from Comcare.

According to the Australian Bureau of Statistics, about 42 per cent of men will experience a mental health disorder in their lives; they are our partners, family, friends, and colleagues. So, how can everyone contribute to lifting the stigma around men’s mental health, and buil...

Today, Dr Antonio Di Dio from the Professional Services Review talks about how to identify burnout and support yourself and your team members when they struggle with mental health challenges.

The end of the year is inching closer, but for many working in the public sector, the next time-hungry project is just around the corner, increasing pressure on their mental health and wellbeing. In 2023, 1 in 3 respondents to the APS Census reported feeling burnt out by their work – so, how can organisations and individuals stem the tide?

On this episode of Work with Purpose, ho...

Sam Jeffries from the Australian Public Service Commission, Julie Hansen from the Department of Defence, and Stella Renagi from the Australian Taxation Office join us on this episode to discuss the Collaboration Circle, a new model centering First Nations experiences in the APS.

Effective engagement with First Nations peoples to ensure better recruitment, retention and advancement is a priority under the Australian Public Service Reform pillar ‘The APS as a model employer’. Collaboration Circle is a recent initiative under this pillar in line with Closing the Gap Priority Reform 3, designed to ensure that the experience of Firs...

On this episode, Colonel Jennifer Harris from the Australian Army gives us a masterclass in managing change in complex organisations, based on her experience with the Army’s Digital Twin.

Change can be difficult – as individuals, we prefer stability and predictability. Particularly when working in large organisations, it can be both an opportunity and a great challenge to align everyone to achieve a common change goal. But the Australian Army’s ongoing Digital Twin project showcases how it can be done successfully.

On this episode of Work with Purpose, Colonel Jennifer Harris explores how th...

Jim Betts, Secretary of the Department of Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development, Communications and the Arts, talks about shaping his role as APS CALD Champion and why he wants leaders to take action to achieve equality.

Our recent episode on CALD representation in the senior executive left many of us and our listeners humbled. Australia’s public service is diverse, yet there is still some way to go to achieve true equality for CALD employees in its senior ranks.

This time, Jim Betts joins host David Pembroke, CEO of contentgroup, to talk about the Se...

Adam Fennessy PSM, Secretary of the Department of Agriculture, shares tips for having difficult conversations and an insight into the department’s recent Growing Australia Together strategy on this episode of Work with Purpose.

Where is the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Forestry headed under its recent Growing Australia Together strategy? And what are Secretary Adam Fennessy’s priorities based on the department’s capability review?

Host David Pembroke and Adam discuss how ‘Growing Australia Together’ aims to increase the value of agriculture production and expand trade markets, protect the country’s food and fibre fr...

On this episode, Dr Suzanne Akila, Jo Talbot, and Radi Kovacevic talk us through CALD representation in the public service, and what it will take for more culturally and linguistically diverse employees to succeed in the senior executive.

Australia is a truly multicultural nation, with over 21 percent of the country's population born overseas. As this demographic has grown over the years, so has the number of culturally and linguistically diverse (CALD) employees in the public service. However, this isn’t broadly reflected in the senior executive level. Earlier this year, the public service launched its CALD Em...

The Hon Dr Andrew Leigh MP joins us on the episode of Work with Purpose to highlight how evaluation can help create better policies and programs.

On a recent episode of Work with Purpose on the art of policymaking, our experts agreed that evaluation should be baked into the development process from the get-go – but how do you make it work when the pressure is high?

The Hon Dr Andrew Leigh MP, Assistant Minister for Competition, Charities and Treasury, and Assistant Minister for Employment, joins presenter David Pembroke to talk about why evaluation sh...

Lydia Milosavljevic from the Department of Climate Change, Energy, the Environment and Water and Zoe Scanlon from the Attorney-General’s Department give us a masterclass in executive support on this episode of Work with Purpose.

What does it take to build a superstar executive support team?

Hear from Lydia Milosavljevic, executive assistant to Deputy Secretary Simon Duggan at the Department of Climate Change, Energy, the Environment and Water, and Zoe Scanlon, chief of staff to Katherine Jones PSM, Secretary of the Attorney-General’s Department, about how to grow collaboration, prioritise appropriately, and build trus...

If your team is grappling with an increasingly busy workload, today’s episode of Work with Purpose with Martin Hehir PSM and Kathy Hilyard will give you some useful tips on how better collaboration can become part of the solution.

With a busy work program following the pandemic, Martin Hehir PSM, deputy secretary, Governance and Corporate and chief operating officer, Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet, and his team faced this exact challenge while working at the Attorney-General’s Department. At the time, Martin had an inkling that expanding collaboration might be the key to meet...

A stronger emphasis on merit now will be crucial to ensure a thriving public service in the future, former APS Commissioner Andrew Podger AO tells us on this episode of Work with Purpose.

APS Reform is in full swing, but what else could be added to the agenda? On this episode, we hear the perspective of former senior public servant, now commentor and researcher, Andrew Podger AO on the value of merit, where stewardship is appropriate, and what has affected capability within Australia’s public sector.

In discussion with IPAA National President Andrew Me...

Dr Wendy Craik AM FTSE joins us for this episode reflecting on a career of curiosity and collaboration in service of Australia’s marine environment.

Dr Wendy Craik AM FTSE has had a long and distinguished career across science, not-for-profits and the public sector. What has she learned along the way, from her time as a PhD candidate in Canada researching fish to working on the first management plans for the Great Barrier Reef?

Find out on this episode of Work with Purpose as David Pembroke sits down with Wendy to discuss her go...

In a first for Work with Purpose, we welcome The Hon Patrick Gorman MP to talk about his journey into politics, supporting the Prime Minister, and his vision for the use of artificial intelligence in the public service.

From Assistant Minister to the Public Service, to Assistant Minister to the Prime Minister, to – more recently – Assistant Minister to the Attorney-General, the Hon Patrick Gorman MP covers an extensive portfolio of work. On this episode of Work with Purpose, he tells us how he keeps up with his responsibilities, and why he enjoys working to support Australia’s comm...

Dr Trish Mercer, Andrew Tongue PSM and Fiona Barbaro PSM return to complete your policy essentials class with a focus on the mystical policy window, the art of foresight, and the power of evaluation.

In today’s complex and fast-moving environment, opportunities to introduce a policy can be tricky to identify. Dr Trish Mercer from the Australian National University, experienced former public servant Andrew Tongue PSM, and Fiona Barbaro PSM from the ACT Government tell us how to ensure you’re ready when the policy window opens.

The panel also dives into why fore...

Dr Trish Mercer, Andrew Tongue PSM and Fiona Barbaro PSM take us back to the essentials of policy-making – from understanding the political environment to creating a convincing narrative.

What do you need to know about the political environment to make good policy? And how do you create a narrative that gets people on board with your proposal?

In this first Work with Purpose episode in our two-part series on policymaking, host David Pembroke gets back to the basics of policy development, advice, and evaluation with Dr Trish Mercer from the Australian National University, experienced fo...

Matt Yannopoulos PSM, Associate Secretary of the Department of Defence, maps out a unified approach for the public service to defend Australia’s interests.

In a world with increasing geopolitical tension, collaboration across the public service remains key to protecting Australia’s security and prosperity. On this episode, David Pembroke sits down with Matt Yannopoulos PSM, Associate Secretary of Defence, to explore what it takes to do this well.

They delve into the importance of a whole-of-government approach, emphasising the need for speed, focus, and coordination across various government agencies to enhance national security and...

In celebration of NAIDOC Week, Corey Tutt OAM from DeadlyScience and artist Ben Williams share the spirit of pride in their heritage and work. They invite you to listen closely to create true connections with First Nations peoples.

How can all Australians join in celebrating First Nations peoples’ contributions? And what will it take for the public sector to become a genuine partner for Indigenous-led organisations?

On this Work with Purpose episode in celebration of NAIDOC Week, Corey Tutt OAM and Ben Williams share their journey of connection and partnership that culminated in th...

Dr Amaly Khalaf and Dr Steven Munns from the Australian Public Service Commission explore psychological safety in public sector workplaces – from the desk to the frontlines.

Creating workplaces which are both mentally and physically safe is a mission close to Dr Amaly Khalaf’s and Dr Steven Munn’s hearts. On this episode of Work with Purpose, they talk us through how the public sector is working towards this – from exemplary and trustful leadership to processes grounded in evidence.

Amaly, principal psychologist and lead of the APS Mental Health and Suicide Prevention Unit, shines a light...

Secretary of the Department of Health and Aged Care Blair Comley PSM tells the story of his public service career, and highlights how devolving leadership in the public sector can reduce risk, increase work quality and staff satisfaction.

Blair Comley PSM looks back at an outstanding career across the public and private sectors, from designing the GST to driving the Department of Health and Aged Care’s recent capability review.

On this episode of Work with Purpose, he revisits some of the milestones of his career and how they have shaped his approach to de...

As the UN Climate Change Conference wraps up in Bonn, our Work with Purpose guests Dr Mara Hammerle and Andrew Hudson discuss the link between climate change and wellbeing and share some innovative ideas for greening government procurement.

Climate change remains one of the world’s most complex and systemic challenges. With a profound effect on human wellbeing, experts across the world are looking for ways to reduce its impact and embed better policy solutions.

On this episode of Work with Purpose, Dr Mara Hammerle and Andrew Hudson from the Centre for Policy De...

On today’s Work with Purpose episode, Director General of IP Australia, Michael Schwager tells IP Australia’s innovation success story, and how the broader public sector can follow in its steps.

Did you know that 57 per cent of IP Australia's staff rate their culture as positively supporting innovation, 18 per cent higher than the APS average? Today, we hear from with Michael Schwager, Director General of IP Australia, about pioneering innovation in the public sector in conversation with host David Pembroke.

Michael shares how IP Australia balances risk and innovation to create...

On today’s Work with Purpose episode, Dr Nina Terry, Bec Bodel and Professor Brenton Prosser help you learn the ropes of human-centred design.

In today's complex world, how can the public sector effectively ensure that its policies and programs are centred on the needs of the people they serve? This episode explores human-centered design as one piece to solving this puzzle.

Host David Pembroke convenes class with three leading experts in the design space: Bec Bodel from the Australian Taxation Office, Brenton Prosser from UNSW Canberra, and Dr Nina Terrey from ThinkPlace. Tog...

Today, we celebrate 100 episodes of Work with Purpose with a special conversation between two passionate public servants: Dr Gordon de Brouwer, Australian Public Service Commissioner and Thanuri Welaratne, education programs officer at Questacon. Together, they explore Gordon’s extensive career journey, covering the APS reform agenda and his report on bullying and harassment.

Gordon highlights the critical role public servants play in maintaining democratic governance and upholding the principles of transparency, accountability and service to the community. Along with Thanuri, Gordon also discusses how public servants can navigate work-life balance, and what flexibility means post-pandemic.